Lakewood Shabbos rally

[yesitsme]

http://he.wikipedia.org/wiki/פינחס

I once heard that קנאות is like a needle, if it has a hole on top you can sew with it, otherwise you can only use it to poke.

[Achas Veachas]

It's interesting that this whole thing happened this past Shabbos. Behasgachah Pratis the Hayom Yom for Friday (26 Sivan) gave guidelines for how to do the Mitzvah of Hocheach Tochiach:

קודם ציווי הוכח תוכיח, כתיב ולא תשנא את אחיך, כי זהו תנאי מוקדם להוכחה. ואח"ז [ואחר זה] כתיב ולא תשא עליו חטא, שאם לא פעלה ההוכחה, בודאי אתה האשם, שלא היו דברים היוצאים מן הלב.

[flyingace]

So that those making the Mechaah can say Ani Es Nafshi Hitzalti and let the rest go to...?

Don't believe that is the attitude here. There is real pain and sympathy in Lakewood for these kids and their families;maybe not everyone, but it's there and I think most of these kids have come across such attitudes as well.
Again, the blatant chillul Shabbos cannot just be ignored. I think it's not really the same exact issue...

[Achas Veachas]

Don't believe that is the attitude here. There is real pain and sympathy in Lakewood for these kids and their families;maybe not everyone, but it's there and I think most of these kids have come across such attitudes as well.
Again, the blatant chillul Shabbos cannot just be ignored. I think it's not really the same exact issue...

I want doubting that there are those in Lakewood who care about these kids, I was just questioning the attitude of making a Machaah for the sake of Machaah...

[username]

When you say the tefillah of the Shila"h, have these kids and their parents in mind.

[avromie7]

Don't believe that is the attitude here. There is real pain and sympathy in Lakewood for these kids and their families;maybe not everyone, but it's there and I think most of these kids have come across such attitudes as well.
Again, the blatant chillul Shabbos cannot just be ignored. I think it's not really the same exact issue...

That attitude comes from few people the overwhelming majority of Lakewood is not accepting of them and instead of just being nice and smiling at them they stare them down for wearing jeans
As far as allowing chillul shabbos goes, before deciding to make a protest the first thing to think about is what am I trying to accomplish and will it be accomplished and the clear answer to that question to anyone who understands the situation is no

[aygart]

I want doubting that there are those in Lakewood who care about these kids, I was just questioning the attitude of making a Machaah for the sake of Machaah...

Which you seem to have assumed was the reason for organizing this

[Achas Veachas]

Which you seem to have assumed was the reason for organizing this

I was replying to this:

I once heard an interesting thought in regards to the many macho's made in eretz yisroel about chillul shabbos. The purpose is not to change the action of those being mechallel shabbos but to make sure that one does not become desensitized to the big deal that it is.

[Talmid Muvhak]

That attitude comes from few people the overwhelming majority of Lakewood is not accepting of them and instead of just being nice and smiling at them they stare them down for wearing jeans
As far as allowing chillul shabbos goes, before deciding to make a protest the first thing to think about is what am I trying to accomplish and will it be accomplished and the clear answer to that question to anyone who understands the situation is no

+613.

[Aj3042]

I don't know how you define C"H, but IMHO anytime a yid does not act the way g-d intended, and causes others - even Jews - to look at klal Yisroel in a bad light, that is a chillul hashem !!!

First off, it's not a matter of opinion but Halacha. Second, no offense meant but from your remarks it's clear you're not well aware of these halachos bec in actuality the MAIN din of chillul hashem is with other Jews, not non Jews. Now this isn't a discussion for now but look in the halachos and you'll be hard pressed to show how peaceful shabbos protests, whether you agree with them or not, can possibly fall under the geder chillul hashem.
People throw around the term like its catch phrase or something and it's not. It's a set of halachos.

[AnonymousUser]

I once heard an interesting thought in regards to the many macho's made in eretz yisroel about chillul shabbos. The purpose is not to change the action of those being mechallel shabbos but to make sure that one does not become desensitized to the big deal that it is.

I believe it was the Brisker Rav.

[doodle]

First off, it's not a matter of opinion but Halacha. Second, no offense meant but from your remarks it's clear you're not well aware of these halachos bec in actuality the MAIN din of chillul hashem is with other Jews, not non Jews. Now this isn't a discussion for now but look in the halachos and you'll be hard pressed to show how peaceful shabbos protests, whether you agree with them or not, can possibly fall under the geder chillul hashem.
People throw around the term like its catch phrase or something and it's not. It's a set of halachos.

+10000
IN THE DAYS OF CHAZAL EVERY ONE OF THESE KIDS WOULD BE STONED TO DEATH.
that does not make it not sad or heartbreaking , but these kids are doing wicked sins.

[avromie7]

+10000
IN THE DAYS OF CHAZAL EVERY ONE OF THESE KIDS WOULD BE STONED TO DEATH.
that does not make it not sad or heartbreaking , but these kids are doing wicked sins.

I will ask you the same question I asked everyone who took that position or a similar position
Do you know any of them?

[doodle]

if these kids got together and raped passer byes , ...
would avromie7 be proudly saying , he is on level6 ?

[avromie7]

if these kids got together and raped passer byes , ...
would avromie7 be proudly saying , he is on level6 ?

If it was your kid would you still say that?
Please answer honestly

[doodle]

i am not saying i have a solution , but the way you proudly defend ppl , who nebach are doing
absolutely vile behaviours is SHAMEFULL !

[avromie7]

i am not saying i have a solution , but the way you proudly defend ppl , who nebach are doing
absolutely vile behaviours is SHAMEFULL !

The way you defend those who have no interested in helping them out and instead want to push them further away is a definitely a lot more shameful than trying to help out those who have been burned because they don't fit in the cookie cutter

[doodle]

if someones son was CHILD MOLESTER or a WIFE ABUSER .....
would they be shocked if ppl protested

you dont care enough about shabbos  ! (level6)

[Freddie]

+10000
IN THE DAYS OF CHAZAL EVERY ONE OF THESE KIDS WOULD BE STONED TO DEATH.
that does not make it not sad or heartbreaking , but these kids are doing wicked sins.

Aren't you the same dude from shaving thread? I love it! 

[coralsnake]

IN THE DAYS OF CHAZAL EVERY ONE OF THESE KIDS WOULD BE STONED TO DEATH.

Highly unlikely.