So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem

[Aj3042]

So they are both wrong. I think most here agree on that. Why do you feel the need to condemn the paraders specifically in this thread about the horrific actions of a deranged murderer? If you have a problem with the parade, why not start your own thread about your feelings about the parade?

Because given the depravity of the parade my reaction to what happened is-no sympathy!

[Aj3042]

Aj3042 and doddleydoo are just homophobes.
Not an opinion. Fact.

That's a classical liberal approach to these things-labeling. People who denounce radical Islam are Islamophobes, those who oppose gay marriage are homophobes, etc, it's a way of delegitimizing the idea. Either way, God himself seems to be very homophobic based on how he said they should be dealt with so I reckon I'm in good company.

[stbaum]

I was going to post this in the pictures thread but I think it better fits here:

[gavhaller]

That's a classical liberal approach to these things-labeling. People who denounce radical Islam are Islamophobes, those who oppose gay marriage are homophobes, etc, it's a way of delegitimizing the idea. Either way, God himself seems to be very homophobic based on how he said they should be dealt with so I reckon I'm in good company.

The only person that is delegitimizing anything here, is you.
"I'm more offended by the parade, than when one of my own people murders another of my own.

I'd like to see the outcome of this situation if you had any REAL emotional attachement to either party. Right now, you sit behind a screen and blurt whatever passuk or meforesh comes to mind.

Are you american? It seems your only line of recourse is by calling people - O So American.

God also doesn't like shellfish.
Should have killed my grandfather back in 1928 when I had the chance. He ate tons of lobster.

[aygart]

I'd like to see the outcome of this situation if you had any REAL emotional attachement to either party. Right now, you sit behind a screen and distorting whatever passuk or meforesh comes to mind.

FTFY. I and others have called you out on that a few times here and in other threads and you usually don't respond-just like here.

I responded to him the followingThere is no din of kanoim pogim for this. Find a source for your am ha'aratzus. You are also being migale ponim shelo kihalacha. The gemora in Sanhedrin considers that worse than an apikores. Wrong again. That is because there is a mitzvah upon beis din called vihitzilu hoedo that even when there are eidim and hasro'o they should actively search for technicalities to get him off the hook.It is amazing how you feel that you are sticking up for the torah when you are going against it

[Aj3042]

The only person that is delegitimizing anything here, is you.
"I'm more offended by the parade, than when one of my own people murders another of my own.

I'd like to see the outcome of this situation if you had any REAL emotional attachement to either party. Right now, you sit behind a screen and blurt whatever passuk or meforesh comes to mind.

Are you american? It seems your only line of recourse is by calling people - O So American.

God also doesn't like shellfish.
Should have killed my grandfather back in 1928 when I had the chance. He ate tons of lobster.

Actually yes among my circles many of the people I know reacted in a very similar fashion to the stabbing (once it was murder is certainly is much more regrettable). Obviously the DDF is to the left of the people I hang out with.

[gavhaller]

Actually yes among my circles many of the people I know reacted in a very similar fashion to the stabbing (once it was murder is certainly is much more regrettable). Obviously the DDF is to the left of the people I hang out with.

It's a shame. You could have been a good person like rest of us too.

[Aj3042]

FTFY. I and others have called you out on that a few times here and in other threads and you usually don't respond-just like here.

Here's my last comment in this interview. You seem to have misunderstood my intentions. I did not say this man was "kanoin pogin bo". That's quite obviously not the case-as others pointed out there are numerous qualifications to that psak none of which fit this instance. It wasn't "during the maaseh" and it's not even the issur on which that din was said-"boel nochris". I think that's quite obvious and I'm surprised you keep bringing it up as if you've found some ingenious answer to my points. Had this case fallen under this din I would've most certainly supported the stabber wholeheartedly. I assumed we all realized this din doesn't fit here.
What I did say was that given that these paraders were actively flaunting god's word which is the very definition of chillul Hashem (worse than the stabbing) i'm not going to feel bad for them that they met their match, nor will I condemn the actions of the deranged stabber. Thaat's what I actually said so don't bring up "kanoin pogin bo" which has no direct application here. If you'd open your ears and listen to the deafening silence of the chareidi world to this act you'd come to the conclusion that many people are thinking exactly what I just said. They met their match.

[beeweegee]

Actually yes among my circles many of the people I know reacted in a very similar fashion to the stabbing (once it was murder is certainly is much more regrettable). Obviously the DDF is to the left of the people I hang out with.

Because given the depravity of the parade my reaction to what happened is-no sympathy!

[Yehuda57]

I think having people dignify these comments with responses lowers the standard of discourse on this forum. What is great about DDF if the quality of discussion. Admittedly, that drops significantly in many JS threads, but when you engage one person praising murder, and another saying murder is not as bad as attending a gay pride parade, you've "wrestled with a pig in the mud," and allowed them a platform to spout their ignorant, horrific hate speech. This thread moves beyond trolling and into justifying murder - this is no march by a lake or political candidate we're speaking about.

Yes, community leaders need to unite in condemnation and horror. But to us, they should be seen to be stating the obvious, the likes of which need not be defended to indefensible morons and hateful idiots on online forums. I have made the decision not to no longer respond to Doodle or AJ in JS threads. I hope many more who will join me.

I think this just about sums it up:

https://youtu.be/n5Se3LMVPNs?t=2m17s

“In the name of what Torah, in the name of what God, does someone go and murder, do people go and burn a baby and his entire family? Whose Torah is this?”

[Dan]

I have made the decision not to no longer respond to Doodle or AJ in JS threads. I hope many more who will join me.

Sadly I made that decision previously and still got dragged into the mud

[Yehuda57]

Sadly I made that decision previously and still got dragged into the mud

I noticed. It's just so difficult to hold back in the face of such infuriating rhetoric.

[Dan]

Somehow I felt guilty by association by not condemning it.

[gavhaller]

Somehow I felt guilty by association by not condemning it.

Does DDF support a removal of aggressive members feature?

[Dan]

Does DDF support a removal of aggressive members feature?

I think so, but there was a practical mutiny here when Chaikel merely suspended another member for a week for what he felt crossed the line.

[gavhaller]

I think so, but there was a practical mutiny here when Chaikel merely suspended another member for a week for what he felt crossed the line.

Aj feels that DDF is too much to the "left"
Its your call boss.

[aygart]

Here's my last comment in this interview.

Yipeeeee!!!!!

Here's my last comment in this interview. You seem to have misunderstood my intentions. I did not say this man was "kanoin pogin bo". ....... I assumed we all realized this din doesn't fit here.

Let's go to the video tape.....
He wrote

Even if I would see someone in the act... and shoot them dead , as THE HALACHA SANCTIONS,

About which you wrote

Well he happens to be right about what he just quoted.

That leaves us with a few choices.

• You have reading comprehension issues
• you write without thinking
• You have a difficult time expressing what you are really trying to say
• you are an am haaretz
• you are depraved
• all of the above

[aygart]

I think so, but there was a practical mutiny here when Chaikel merely suspended another member for a week for what he felt crossed the line.

In that case many felt that it was more for disagreeing with him than anything else. That was a far cry from condoning a murder.

[Dan]

In that case many felt that it was more for disagreeing with him than anything else. That was a far cry from condoning a murder.

And Chaikel felt that the post was pure libel for calling someone a murderer and had nothing to do with a disagreement.  Never mind that it was a suspension, not  ban.
Then again the media called Sharon a murderer for allegedly instigating the 2nd intifada by doing the same thing.

Bottom line is that this forum is extremely lightly moderated and people seem to have become too accustomed to that.  I do agree that the posts here by aj3042 and doodle are just beyond the pale, so I welcome your opinions.

[gavhaller]

I do agree that the posts here by aj3042 and doodleydooo are just beyond the pale.

FTFY.