Author Topic: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem  (Read 26197 times)

Offline Achas Veachas

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #60 on: July 31, 2015, 06:12:24 AM »
I'm not sure we got the same guy then. The Halacha, as paskened by the Rambam and agreed by most rishonim, is that "there is no difference between this world and the days of Moshiach other than our subservience to other nations"-meaning that everything, including poverty and social injustices will remain the same (this point is stated explicitly), and that the only difference will be that we will be living under Moshiach the king in a land ruled by Halacha and not by non Jews. Furthermore, the Rambam states clearly that moshiach wll have children and die and someone from his family will succeed him. You are probably confusing Moshiach with the term "olam habah" which is not the same thing.
What a shame, seems like you learned the beginning of the Perek in Rambam and then fell asleep before you reached the end, you were so close to finishing the entire Rambam...

Offline chaimmayer

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #61 on: July 31, 2015, 07:56:22 AM »
Are people making shlissel challah this week?

Offline DP7

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #62 on: July 31, 2015, 08:30:15 AM »

a great sin, one of the only ones that the Torah calls an "abomination"

Guess this should be his next place of attack then http://peishellfish.com/

Offline jj1000

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #63 on: July 31, 2015, 09:36:31 AM »
we'll I've got some news your orthodoxy is definitely questionable
And this is proof of your orthodoxy :P
See my 5 step program to your left <--

(Real signature under my location)

Offline AsherO

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #64 on: July 31, 2015, 09:46:40 AM »
Either way, he will kill the wicked first.

Where do you get this from? The Rambam says that when it says the sheep will lie with the lamb it means that in Moshiach's times the Jewish people will live in peace alongside the evil of the earth, are you suggesting that the evil gentiles will be allowed to live, but the evil Jews are going to be killed? That just seems absurd.

Offline AsherO

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #65 on: July 31, 2015, 09:50:25 AM »
I'm not sure we got the same guy then. The Halacha, as paskened by the Rambam and agreed by most rishonim, is that "there is no difference between this world and the days of Moshiach other than our subservience to other nations"-meaning that everything, including poverty and social injustices will remain the same (this point is stated explicitly), and that the only difference will be that we will be living under Moshiach the king in a land ruled by Halacha and not by non Jews. Furthermore, the Rambam states clearly that moshiach wll have children and die and someone from his family will succeed him. You are probably confusing Moshiach with the term "olam habah" which is not the same thing.

Where do you get any of this from? It isn't in Perek 11/12 of Hilchos Melachim...

לא נתאוו החכמים והנביאים לימות המשיח לא כדי שישלטו על כל העולם ולא כדי שירדו בעכו"ם ולא כדי שינשאו אותם העמים

Don't try to teach Rambam to a Lubavticher*, definitely not Rambam that pretains to Moshiach.

*Briskers get a pass, are you a Brisker?

Offline good sam

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #66 on: July 31, 2015, 10:03:53 AM »
Are people making shlissel challah this week?
More likely putting him in a jail cell and throwing away the shlissel.
If you don't care why would you comment?
HT: DMYD

Offline joshnuss

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #67 on: July 31, 2015, 10:33:02 AM »
I think he got spurned by some people in the parade hence the stabbing..........

Offline Aj3042

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #68 on: July 31, 2015, 10:39:17 AM »
Where do you get any of this from? It isn't in Perek 11/12 of Hilchos Melachim...

לא נתאוו החכמים והנביאים לימות המשיח לא כדי שישלטו על כל העולם ולא כדי שירדו בעכו"ם ולא כדי שינשאו אותם העמים

Don't try to teach Rambam to a Lubavticher*, definitely not Rambam that pretains to Moshiach.

*Briskers get a pass, are you a Brisker?
Check again Rambam Hilchos Melachim Perek 12 Halacha 2 says it straight out. And Lubavitchers are far from owning a monopoly over the Rambam and particularly over his views of Mashiach.
ETA-just kitchen your "Briskers get q pass line". LOL I'm not a brisker but still they have no monopoly either.

Offline elit

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #69 on: July 31, 2015, 12:13:22 PM »
Rabbi Aryeh Shtern, the Rabbi of Jerusalem, visits one of those wounded in yesterday's parade. The wounded man came to be a supporter of the communnuity in yesterday's demonstration. The Rabbi informed him firmly that Judaism and spilling of blood are not compatible (don't go together). The Rabbi prayed for his recovery and all of the injured in the attack. Shabbat shalom.

הרב אריה שטרן

רבה של ירושלים מבקר את אחד מהפצועים מהמצעד אתמול. הפצוע בא לתמוך בקהילה אמש בהפגנה. הרב הודיע לו בנחרצות שיהדות ושפיכות דמים אינם הולכים ביחד.
הרב התפלל להחלמתו ולהחלמת כל הפצועים.
שבת שלו


Where does he fit into your view of daas torah @doodle @aj3042

Offline Aj3042

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #70 on: July 31, 2015, 12:21:29 PM »
@elit I don't think anyone is really condoning or recommending the stabber's course of action, we're simply stating that we are more disgusted with the actual parade in which multitudes desecrated the name of hashem than the stabbing which was one zealot who took things into his own hands. Furthermore, as per the title of the thread, the stabber is just as Jewish (actually much more so but whatever) than the gay protesters. What this Rabbi did doesn't contradict this sentiment, and even if it did, it's still a total non issue. He's not Moshe Rabbeinu that we can't argue on him, nor is he even one of our great poskim. He's a rov, and probably a talmid chacham, but he knows the same sources as anyone else does. No worries, I'll go into Meah Shearim and I'll find you a Rav who holds that the stabber was mekadesh shem shamayim and is a big tzadik if that's what you want.

ETA: I also hope you can differentiate between political rabbanus and real rabannus. If the Israeli chief Rabbinate camr out with a statement about this it would as much as Obama deciding on a matter of Halacha-purely political. I don't think you'll see Rav Chaim Kanievsky, for example, visiting these people, regardless of what he holds on the matter, given that he's not involved in politics. So what would be appropriate is perhaps quoting me a source in Halacha on the matter, not pointing to political showmanship as proof of the Halacha.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2015, 12:26:52 PM by Aj3042 »

Offline doodle

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #71 on: July 31, 2015, 12:23:47 PM »
@elit I don't think anyone is really condoning or recommending the stabber's course of action, we're simply stating that we are more disgusted with the actual parade in which multitudes desecrated the name of hashem than the stabbing which was one zealot who took things into his own hands. Furthermore, as per the title of the thread, the stabber is just as Jewish (actually much more so but whatever) than the gay protesters. What this Rabbi did doesn't contradict this sentiment, and even if it did, it's still a total non issue. He's not Moshe Rabbeinu that we can't argue on him, nor is he even one of our great poskim. He's a rov, and probably a talmid chacham, but he knows the same sources as anyone else does. No worries, I'll go into Meah Shearim and I'll find you a Rav who holds that the stabber was mekadesh shem shamayim and is a big tzadik if that's what you want.
+1
Salt Is Good

Offline doodle

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #72 on: July 31, 2015, 12:25:57 PM »
BTW  who is Rav Aryeh Stern.. being a Rabbi from Jerusalem is not exactly rare....
I dont know otherwise , but please provide credentials .
Salt Is Good

Offline Centro

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #73 on: July 31, 2015, 12:27:07 PM »
Rabbi Aryeh Shtern, the Rabbi of Jerusalem, visits one of those wounded in yesterday's parade. The wounded man came to be a supporter of the communnuity in yesterday's demonstration. The Rabbi informed him firmly that Judaism and spilling of blood are not compatible (don't go together). The Rabbi prayed for his recovery and all of the injured in the attack. Shabbat shalom.

הרב אריה שטרן

רבה של ירושלים מבקר את אחד מהפצועים מהמצעד אתמול. הפצוע בא לתמוך בקהילה אמש בהפגנה. הרב הודיע לו בנחרצות שיהדות ושפיכות דמים אינם הולכים ביחד.
הרב התפלל להחלמתו ולהחלמת כל הפצועים.
שבת שלו


Where does he fit into your view of daas torah @doodle @aj3042
I hope while he was in the hospital he also made time to visit a few God fearing frum people who are also in hospital.

Offline Aj3042

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #74 on: July 31, 2015, 12:28:31 PM »
I hope while he was in the hospital he also made time to visit a few God fearing frum people who are also in hospital.
LOL given that politics was on his mind, not bikur cholim, I find that unlikely.

Offline elit

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #75 on: July 31, 2015, 01:03:01 PM »
LOL given that politics was on his mind, not bikur cholim, I find that unlikely.
So Mivazeh taldmid chacham brabim is not part of your religion

Offline Aj3042

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #76 on: July 31, 2015, 01:10:44 PM »
So Mivazeh taldmid chacham brabim is not part of your religion
Mivazeh taldmid chacham? LOL seriously? Who was mevazeh him? Me, by saying that his visit was political? Are you seriously naive enough to believe it wasn't? When did stating the obvious about political rabannus become mevazeh a talmid chacham? In fact I went out of my way to say he was probably (though I don't know him) a talmid chahcam and a fine man. That doesn't mean that the earth he walks on is holy or that his political hospital visit was apolitical, Please, by realistic.

Offline elit

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #77 on: July 31, 2015, 01:11:49 PM »
Mivazeh taldmid chacham? LOL seriously? Who was mevazeh him? Me, by saying that his visit was political? Are you seriously naive enough to believe it wasn't? When did stating the obvious about political rabannus become mevazeh a talmid chacham? In fact I went out of my way to say he was probably (though I don't know him) a talmid chahcam and a fine man. That doesn't mean that the earth he walks on is holy or that his political hospital visit was apolitical, Please, by realistic.
Was trying so hard not to get involved and got sucked in. I'm out.

Offline Aj3042

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #78 on: July 31, 2015, 01:14:40 PM »
Was trying so hard not to get involved and got sucked in. I'm out.
Honestly I was trying pretty hard too. I think I'm also out (unless I'm drawn back in  ::)) I'll let others take it over.

Offline elit

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #79 on: July 31, 2015, 01:15:37 PM »
Honestly I was trying pretty hard too. I think I'm also out (unless I'm drawn back in  ::)) I'll let others take it over.
You're out of your own fight?  Who are the others?