Author Topic: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem  (Read 26171 times)

Offline Aj3042

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #80 on: July 31, 2015, 01:16:12 PM »
You're out of your own fight?  Who are the others?
LOL look and you shall find. There were others.

Offline grodnoking

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #81 on: July 31, 2015, 01:18:42 PM »
Honestly I was trying pretty hard too. I think I'm also out (unless I'm drawn back in  ::)) I'll let others take it over.
Wheres CM? He's probably not following but I don't think it'll stop him...
I'm not who you think I am.

Online aygart

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #82 on: July 31, 2015, 01:22:31 PM »
Honestly I was trying pretty hard too.
lol
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline Aj3042

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #83 on: July 31, 2015, 01:23:04 PM »
lol
I admit it's funny. This is when I am trying.  ;D

Offline ChaimMoskowitz

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #84 on: July 31, 2015, 01:36:06 PM »
Wheres CM? He's probably not following but I don't think it'll stop him...
I have many that help me follow. Since it is Friday I am due for a smart a$$ remark. I hate to disappoint but let me try this. All this back and forth ripping on each other and the rabbi's did you ever stop and think what this says about your religion to an outsider if that matters at all to you?
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Offline yhaller14

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #85 on: July 31, 2015, 01:36:52 PM »
And this is proof of your orthodoxy
That's what I was trying to prove  . Isn't that how it works? The nastier you the more religious you are?
"In the end we only regret the chances we didn't take"

Offline grodnoking

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #86 on: July 31, 2015, 01:40:36 PM »
Honestly I was trying pretty hard too. I think I'm also out (unless I'm drawn back in  ::)) I'll let others take it over.
quote author=Aj3042 link=topic=48901.msg1223361#msg1223361 date=1438363196]
That's not my comment and so I don't need to answer for it. I would think though that he merely meant to express his disgust for the parade and his feeling of "they got what they deserved" and he did so by comparing this guy with Pinchas, though in some ways they are not comparable. I doubt @doodle is going to follow in this guy's footsteps next year and go stab people at the parade. That being said, if I'm mistaken and he actually believes that, that's fine with me. He's entitled to his opinion (gasp!) and his words are a lot less shameful and ridiculous than some others'.
[/quote]
I'm not who you think I am.

Offline yuneeq

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #87 on: July 31, 2015, 02:18:37 PM »
I have many that help me follow. Since it is Friday I am due for a smart a$$ remark. I hate to disappoint but let me try this. All this back and forth ripping on each other and the rabbi's did you ever stop and think what this says about your religion to an outsider if that matters at all to you?

One crazy person is not the official spokesman for our religion.
"If you fall, I will be there." -Floor

Offline ChaimMoskowitz

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #88 on: July 31, 2015, 02:55:38 PM »
One crazy person is not the official spokesman for our religion.
I am not talking about just this thread. Now that you brought it up is there one spokesman for Judaism?
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Offline Aaaron

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #89 on: July 31, 2015, 02:57:20 PM »
One crazy person is not the official spokesman for our religion.

That would be true if all frum Jews condemned his actions and distanced themselves from him.  That's not the case, which is very telling.

I am not talking about just this thread. Now that you brought it up is there one spokesman for Judaism?

Nope.  Too many different sects and types of Jews.

Offline Aj3042

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #90 on: July 31, 2015, 03:01:01 PM »
I am not talking about just this thread. Now that you brought it up is there one spokesman for Judaism?
Yes. He died thousands of years ago and his name was Moses.

Online skyguy918

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #91 on: July 31, 2015, 03:12:02 PM »
I have many that help me follow. Since it is Friday I am due for a smart a$$ remark. I hate to disappoint but let me try this. All this back and forth ripping on each other and the rabbi's did you ever stop and think what this says about your religion to an outsider if that matters at all to you?
To answer this completely outside of the context of this thread, for the most part Judaism as a religion doesn't care what outsiders think about it. There is a concept of Chillul Hashem, which may - in certain limited circumstances - extend to something not otherwise strictly regulated by Jewish law. But even that concept is primarily an internal one (ie what other Jews will think), that is also extended externally.

Offline ChaimMoskowitz

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #92 on: July 31, 2015, 03:13:35 PM »
To answer this completely outside of the context of this thread, for the most part Judaism as a religion doesn't care what outsiders think about it.
I can see why.  ;)
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Offline Aj3042

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #93 on: July 31, 2015, 03:18:44 PM »
To answer this completely outside of the context of this thread, for the most part Judaism as a religion doesn't care what outsiders think about it. There is a concept of Chillul Hashem, which may - in certain limited circumstances - extend to something not otherwise strictly regulated by Jewish law. But even that concept is primarily an internal one (ie what other Jews will think), that is also extended externally.
This is absolutely right. Well said.

Offline Aaaron

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #94 on: July 31, 2015, 03:25:17 PM »
To answer this completely outside of the context of this thread, for the most part Judaism as a religion doesn't care what outsiders think about it. There is a concept of Chillul Hashem, which may - in certain limited circumstances - extend to something not otherwise strictly regulated by Jewish law. But even that concept is primarily an internal one (ie what other Jews will think), that is also extended externally.

This is absolutely right. Well said.

As was mentioned by Zale in the ethical thread:

Taken from OU.org:

The third category is what we typically mean when we talk about chillul Hashem: when someone who should know better acts in a fashion that is perceived to be beneath him. In a Talmudic discussion of what would constitute a chillul Hashem, Rav said it would be if he didnít pay his butcher on time (Yoma 86a). Thatís not such a grievous thing but coming from Rav, it reflects badly on Torah scholars. Each of us at our own level is responsible to strive to act upward and not stoop down.

The reason for this mitzvah is gratitude to God. He created us and gave us everything. How horrible would we be to act in a fashion that makes Him look bad and causes people to say, ďThatís how Jews act?Ē or ďThatís how religious people act?


For some reason the more yeshivish people I've discussed CH with always leave that part out, and try to assert that CH is either solely for Jews, or only regarding violating halacha.

Offline Aj3042

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #95 on: July 31, 2015, 03:30:23 PM »
It's MAINLY for Jews-there's no question about this, it's open pesukim and Gemaras. There is an extension of it, under limited circumstances, to non Jews. Nobody said otherwise.
And for future reference OU.org isn't exactly one of those sources high up there. Gemara, rishonim, shu"a and poskim is a better bet.

Offline Aaaron

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #96 on: July 31, 2015, 03:33:39 PM »
It's MAINLY for Jews-there's no question about this, it's open pesukim and Gemaras. There is an extension of it, under limited circumstances, to non Jews. Nobody said otherwise.
And for future reference OU.org isn't exactly one of those sources high up there. Gemara, rishonim, shu"a and poskim is a better bet.

Source?

And like Wikipedia, OU.org provides sources.

Quote
This mitzvah applies to both men and women in all times and places. It is discussed in the Talmud in the tractates of Yoma (86a) and Sanhedrin (74a-b), and is codified in the Shulchan Aruch in Yoreh Deíah 157. This mitzvah is #63 of the 365 negative mitzvos in the Rambamís Sefer HaMitzvos and #155 of the 194 negative mitzvos that can be observed today in the Chofetz Chaimís Sefer HaMitzvos HaKatzar.


Offline Aj3042

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #97 on: July 31, 2015, 03:39:25 PM »
Source?

And like Wikipedia, OU.org provides sources.
Open Gemara at the end of perek Ben sorer umoreh in Sanhedrin-the ikar din of chillul hashem is only in front of 10 Jews. This has been discussed at length already. None of the sources you quoted have anything to do with the particular point we're discussing of Jews vs non Jews.
Time for me to check out (for real this time) have a good shabbos.

Offline ChaimMoskowitz

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #98 on: July 31, 2015, 03:42:06 PM »
Time for me to check out (for real this time) have a good shabbos.
Enjoy!
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Offline avremie

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Re: So Called Orthodox Jew Stabs 6 at parade in Jerusalem
« Reply #99 on: July 31, 2015, 03:48:51 PM »


Mivazeh taldmid chacham? LOL seriously? Who was mevazeh him? Me, by saying that his visit was political? Are you seriously naive enough to believe it wasn't? When did stating the obvious about political rabannus become mevazeh a talmid chacham? In fact I went out of my way to say he was probably (though I don't know him) a talmid chahcam and a fine man. That doesn't mean that the earth he walks on is holy or that his political hospital visit was apolitical, Please, by realistic.

You went out of your way to say he was a talmid chacham. LOL.