Author Topic: Footsteps - Friend or Foe? (Read 31399 times)

CS1 · « **Reply #100 on:** August 30, 2015, 02:54:56 PM »

Quote from: Dan on August 30, 2015, 11:16:32 AM

Is there no org that encourages people to stay in the fold but teaches life skills and secular studies to be able to get regular jobs?

Project Makom supports people who have questions about their religion. Many teens/mid-20's grew up in ultra-inflexible homes.
This organization provides support, answers, and Shabbatons to work
to assist teens towards the goal of living within the general Orthodox spectrum: http://jewinthecity.com/project-makom/

In addition, Aliya helps boys: http://www.aliyainstitute.com/
And Loft/Aliya Girls: http://www.collive.com/show_news.rtx?id=36855&alias=loft-provides-haven-for-teen-girls

Aj3042 · « **Reply #101 on:** August 30, 2015, 02:56:19 PM »

@Dan-one without the other is not possible.

Quote from: aygart on August 30, 2015, 11:17:36 AM

2. While I can understand how you may make such a distinction I think it is somewhat delusional. It is nearly impossible to have an organization specifically to support them without encouraging them. Even simply making them comfortable in their leaving is encouragement as well. There is no way to do that while stressing that they are doing something wrong.

As I said before, if it were, you would have a point.

Now, if they were helping them to stay within, even on their own terms (different from their upbringing), it would be a different story as well. That is already a good thing.

Dan · « **Reply #102 on:** August 30, 2015, 03:08:18 PM »

Quote from: Aj3042 on August 30, 2015, 02:56:19 PM

@Dan-one without the other is not possible.As I said before, if it were, you would have a point.

Now, if they were helping them to stay within, even on their own terms (different from their upbringing), it would be a different story as well. That is already a good thing.

Are you rallying against the smokers not also encouraging them to leave?
Why not make an org to help them stay within according to this new tolerant AJ?

Aj3042 · « **Reply #103 on:** August 30, 2015, 03:15:48 PM »

Quote from: Dan on August 30, 2015, 03:08:18 PM

Are you rallying against the smokers not also encouraging them to leave?
Why not make an org to help them stay within according to this new tolerant AJ?

Because I have other things to take care of. And I'm unsure why you think i took a turn for tolerance-i'm just as tolerant/intolerant as I always was.
How about you start a thread like "What to do to help OTD kids" or "How to inspire today's generation to stay within" and I'll be plenty tolerant and understanding. However, start a thread like "contribute to an org that promotes going off" or "don't protest chillul shabbos because you might ruffle OTD's feathers'" and I'm going to say it exactly the way it is.
Maybe this way we can channel all this energy into more positive ideas.

doodle · « **Reply #104 on:** August 30, 2015, 04:53:37 PM »

Quote from: Dan on August 30, 2015, 01:34:58 PM

In that case you should be footsteps biggest advocate.

Taking out the weakest links (most dangerous in your book) of the community and pushing them into the secular world where they won't be a bad influence on others.

Are you SOBER??.
your defending, even slightly, an org. run by Rashaim, ?!?

Aaaron · « **Reply #105 on:** August 30, 2015, 04:54:48 PM »

Quote from: doodle on August 30, 2015, 04:53:37 PM

Are you SOBER??.
your defending, even slightly, an org. run by Rashaim, ?!?

Yay! Doodle is here. Now for some popcorn.

Dan · « **Reply #106 on:** August 30, 2015, 04:55:34 PM »

Quote from: doodle on August 30, 2015, 04:53:37 PM

Are you SOBER??.
your defending, even slightly, an org. run by Rashaim, ?!?

I didn't defend them in the slightest, you have reading comprehension issues.

doodle · « **Reply #107 on:** August 30, 2015, 04:58:36 PM »

Quote from: Dan on August 30, 2015, 04:55:34 PM

I didn't defend them in the slightest, you have reading comprehension issues.

equating them to the lakewood rally issue is minimizing their evil.

Dan · « **Reply #108 on:** August 30, 2015, 05:01:48 PM »

Quote from: doodle on August 30, 2015, 04:58:36 PM

equating them to the lakewood rally issue is minimizing their evil.

I didn't equate it!
I asked why someone who was passionately for the rally for 2 stated reasons is anti this org when they seemingly accomplish those 2 reasons...

aygart · « **Reply #109 on:** August 30, 2015, 05:06:55 PM »

Quote from: Dan on August 30, 2015, 04:55:34 PM

you have reading comprehension issues.

+100000 not just here but in general

Aj3042 · « **Reply #110 on:** August 30, 2015, 05:15:23 PM »

Quote from: Aaaron on August 30, 2015, 04:54:48 PM

Yay! Doodle is here. Now for some popcorn.

Those are the exact words I was thinking when I saw he checked in-"Yay doodle is here!"
Thanks for chiming in doodle-they're all yours! Have fun!

Freddie · « **Reply #111 on:** August 30, 2015, 07:19:46 PM »

Dan, I missed 5 pages of this thread but from what I see at a glance is that you are actually trying to have an intelligent discussion. Dan, people who consume cholov akum have timtum hamoach and cannot grasp spiritual concepts let alone even abstract philosophical concepts. They try to make everything grey. There is no right or wrong, black or white. And they are convinced that they are the zealots. They can't hold themselves back from Snickers and they want to be thought of as hardcore.

aygart · « **Reply #112 on:** August 30, 2015, 07:49:13 PM »

Quote from: Freddie on August 30, 2015, 07:19:46 PM

Dan, I missed 5 pages of this thread but from what I see at a glance is that you are actually trying to have an intelligent discussion. Dan, people who consume cholov akum have timtum hamoach and cannot grasp spiritual concepts let alone even abstract philosophical concepts. They try to make everything grey. There is no right or wrong, black or white. And they are convinced that they are the zealots. They can't hold themselves back from Snickers and they want to be thought of as hardcore.

Do you have a source for your insinuation about some here consuming chalav akum?

palm tights · « **Reply #113 on:** August 30, 2015, 08:02:08 PM »

I like to see live and accurate facts ,in the past 18 months ,like 7 footsteps members took there lives as suicide ,that means much to me what a crap of a organization it is

Dan · « **Reply #114 on:** August 30, 2015, 08:05:46 PM »

Might be a terrible organization, but it's not fair to say that it is because of suicides. No doubt people going through that kind of nisayon are in a dark place as it is.

Achas Veachas · « **Reply #115 on:** August 30, 2015, 08:07:51 PM »

Quote from: Dan on August 30, 2015, 08:05:46 PM

Might be a terrible organization, but it's not fair to say that it is because of suicides. No doubt people going through that kind of nisayon are in a dark place as it is.

+1
That's like saying a certain psychologist is horrible because 5 of his patients committed suicide while non of my dentist's patients did...

palm tights · « **Reply #116 on:** August 30, 2015, 08:13:03 PM »

Quote from: Achas Veachas on August 30, 2015, 08:07:51 PM

+1
That's like saying a certain psychologist is horrible because 5 of his patients committed suicide while non of my dentist's patients did...

Thats my point they arent psychological or having doctors ,they have a goal to leave Judaism , and then they leave you hanging

aygart · « **Reply #117 on:** August 30, 2015, 08:13:56 PM »

Quote from: palm tights on August 30, 2015, 08:13:03 PM

Thats my point they arent psychological or having doctors ,they have a goal to leave Judaism , and then they leave you hanging

That may be the case but hos do you see that from there having been suicides?

Dan · « **Reply #118 on:** August 30, 2015, 08:15:15 PM »

Quote from: palm tights on August 30, 2015, 08:13:03 PM

Thats my point they arent psychological or having doctors ,they have a goal to leave Judaism , and then they leave you hanging

And you don't think that being cut off from your family will leave psychological scars?

palm tights · « **Reply #119 on:** August 30, 2015, 08:18:03 PM »

Quote from: aygart on August 30, 2015, 08:13:56 PM

That may be the case but hos do you see that from there having been suicides?

I know personally a few ppl that went thru there system and all they do is to make sure you change ,and they call it be what you want to be and they help you to start ged and they say that they help you get a college degree and to be on your own and to be like all secular ppl in the world and after u start the ged ,they don't know you and least to say that most of them don't pass ged , they have government programs for ged and thats how they make there money and thats all about it ,every person that went thru the system will tell you the same ,they are a bunch of idiots

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Footsteps Friend or For?

Author Topic: Footsteps - Friend or Foe? (Read 31399 times)