US Politics/2016 Election Pick Your Poison Master Thread

[JTZ]

Anyone at the National Park that is intentionally defying their bosses' orders should be fired immediately.

It is not that simple because we are talking about government workers that have protections. The last thing we want is a dictatorship.

[JTZ]

I have good goalposts to use. Let's count how many sunny days there are during each presidency.

So you think how many sunny days has the same effect as the presidents trade and tax policies on the market? Very intelligent thinking on your part. Do you use the same thinking for all your posts here because that would explain a lot of them.

[Cheesecake]

This is why you need goalposts. Market crashes tomorrow and some will say it was in the making. Others will say it is because the market is afraid of Trunps "America first" restrictive trade policy. Others will have their own reasons. You need some benchmark unless the only thing you are looking to do is argue.

Market goes up 20% in the next six months. Some will say it was still a carryover from Obamas policies. Others will say it is because Trumps policies. This goes on forever.

Give me a benchmark to use! 

So we can pretend to know the cause when we likely don't?

No thanks.

[Cheesecake]

So you think how many sunny days has the same effect as the presidents trade and tax policies on the market? Very intelligent thinking on your part. Do you use the same thinking for all your posts here because that would explain a lot of them.

You are being illogical. Just because a president's policies can affect the market doesn't mean it did in any given circumstance, because other factors also have a large effect.

So using "goalposts" as your guide will often lead to false conclusions.

[Boruch999]

It is not that simple because we are talking about government workers that have protections. The last thing we want is a dictatorship.

Govt workers have protections that allow them to express their personal views without facing negative repercussions at work.  Those apply when tweeting from their own, personal twitter account, not when tweeting in an official capacity from a govt twitter account.

I am not a lawyer and the above may not be accurate, but it certainly should be so.

[yuneeq]

It is not that simple because we are talking about government workers that have protections. The last thing we want is a dictatorship.

Dictatorship? Hyperbole much?

Here's what the NY Times has to say:
"The Trump administration has ordered a freeze on federal grant spending at several government agencies, from the Environmental Protection Agency to the Department of Health and Human Services...Longtime employees at three of the agencies — including some career environmental regulators who conceded that they remained worried about what President Trump might do on policy matters — said such orders were not much different from those delivered by the Obama administration as it shifted policies from the departing White House of George W. Bush. They called reactions to the agency memos overblown."

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/25/us/politics/some-agencies-told-to-halt-communications-as-trump-administration-moves-in.html

Good thing our holy press makes sure to spend a day or 2 discussing this fake news.

[JTZ]

You are being illogical. Just because a president's policies can affect the market doesn't mean it did in any given circumstance, because other factors also have a large effect.

So using "goalposts" as your guide will often lead to false conclusions.

False conclusions are from using numbers that are only in your favor which many here do all the time. The new name is "alternative" numbers. You want to complain about this and about that. Give me a benchmark you want to use. If you don't have one then no need to respond.

[JTZ]

Dictatorship? Hyperbole much?

Actually not all. Government employees get fired/suspended all the time when someone higher up thinks they have power they don't. You know what happens in a lot of these cases? They get reinstated with full back pay.

[yuneeq]

Actually not all. Government employees get fired/suspended all the time when someone higher up thinks they have power they don't. You know what happens in a lot of these cases? They get reinstated with full back pay.

I didn't ask about firing and back pay, though I would guess that public insubordination would be grounds for dismissal. You haven't explained the dictatorship part at all.

[aygart]

Actually not all. Government employees get fired/suspended all the time when someone higher up thinks they have power they don't. You know what happens in a lot of these cases? They get reinstated with full back pay.

Including when they directly defy the valid directives and policies of their boss? If that is the case then we need new labor laws.

[JTZ]

Including when they directly defy the valid directives and policies of their boss? If that is the case then we need new labor laws.

The key word there is "valid". In my field I defy so called valid directivities all the time due to they are IMHO safety issues involved.

Also remember this might be some lower level employee that done this. Maybe he never received the memo.

[yuneeq]

The key word there is "valid". In my field I defy so called valid directivities all the time due to they are IMHO safety issues involved.

Also remember this might be some lower level employee that done this. Maybe he never received the memo.

Lol the sole motivation was BECAUSE they received the memo. Don't pretend otherwise.

Now explain again why Trump (administration) is dictator-like for issuing gag orders? Did CNN happen to feed that little nugget to you?

[aygart]

The key word there is "valid". In my field I defy so called valid directivities all the time due to they are IMHO safety issues involved.

Also remember this might be some lower level employee that done this. Maybe he never received the memo.

There is no question that the President has the right to be setting policy in the executive branch.

Of course if it was a mistake that would be taken into consideration.

[aygart]

So you think how many sunny days has the same effect as the presidents trade and tax policies on the market? Very intelligent thinking on your part. Do you use the same thinking for all your posts here because that would explain a lot of them.

How many times have we heard that we need various policies because of climate change?

[JTZ]

Lol the sole motivation was BECAUSE they received the memo. Don't pretend otherwise.

Now explain again why Trump (administration) is dictator-like for issuing gag orders? Did CNN happen to feed that little nugget to you?

You would be shocked how many lower level employees never get the word. Some of this is on purpose as it is a get out of jail free card.

Dictatorship was in reference to be being fired without due process. Can you imagine being by boss? 

[JTZ]

How many times have we heard that we need various policies because of climate change?

Lots!!!

[Cheesecake]

False conclusions are from using numbers that are only in your favor which many here do all the time. The new name is "alternative" numbers. You want to complain about this and about that. Give me a benchmark you want to use. If you don't have one then no need to respond.

I think not having a benchmark is better than having an unreliable one.

[JTZ]

I think no benchmark is better than an unreliable one.

So when you have no benchmark then you can fudge the numbers any way you want to. Sounds like right up your alley. 

[Boruch999]

How many times have we heard that we need various policies because of climate change?

www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQLbakWESkw&list=PLuKg-WhduhkksJoqkj9aJEnN7v0mx8yxC

[Cheesecake]

So when you have no benchmark then you can fudge the numbers any way you want to. Sounds like right up your alley. 

If you have no benchmark, then there are no numbers to fudge.

If you have benchmarks with asterisks, you have a chance at accurate analysis, but yes, it is subject to bias.

Having immovable benchmarks (goalposts) would be great for betting, but not for accurate analysis.