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הוי זהיר בגחלתם שלא תכוה, שנשיכתן נשיכת שועל ועקיצתן עקיצת עקרב, ולחישתן לחישת שרף, וכל דבריהם כגחלי אש

« Last edited by Baruch on March 30, 2016, 01:00:08 PM »

Author Topic: The Tamar Epstein Saga  (Read 280525 times)

Offline Ergel

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1420 on: February 03, 2016, 11:24:22 AM »
Is that the breaking news?
Life isn't about checking the boxes. Nobody cares.

Offline henche

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1421 on: February 03, 2016, 12:24:23 PM »


This wins for most mismatched group of signatories.  Why are Rav Malkiel and Rav Wachtfogel signed as 2 of 7 signatories, together with the roshei yeshiva of shaar hatalmud and Stamford? It looks like they probably peddled this letter around to every rosh yeshiva in America and these 7 agreed to sign--presumably having no idea that several hundred refused to.


Offline Baruch

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1422 on: February 03, 2016, 12:31:40 PM »
This wins for most mismatched group of signatories.  Why are Rav Malkiel and Rav Wachtfogel signed as 2 of 7 signatories, together with the roshei yeshiva of shaar hatalmud and Stamford? It looks like they probably peddled this letter around to every rosh yeshiva in America and these 7 agreed to sign--presumably having no idea that several hundred refused to.
The Rosh Yeshiva of Stamford is (besides for RSK) the #1 Talmid of Rav Aharon alive in America. And The Rosh Yeshiva of Shaar Hatalmud is a known expert on Even Ha'ezer. So it's not as random as you're portraying it.

Offline henche

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1423 on: February 03, 2016, 12:41:03 PM »
The Rosh Yeshiva of Stamford is (besides for RSK) the #1 Talmid of Rav Aharon alive in America. And The Rosh Yeshiva of Shaar Hatalmud is a known expert on Even Ha'ezer. So it's not as random as you're portraying it.

So you don't think it indicates they peddled it to 100 roshei yeshiva and got 7?

Offline dovy2

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1424 on: February 03, 2016, 12:42:26 PM »
Can't speak for eidinson,
but its pretty big for me.

For me this is final. There is nothing more to add and no more letter need be posted as far as I'm concerned.

Poskim, rabbonim, and now the gedoley Roshei Yeshiva have clearly spoken.


A terrible crime was committed and the perpetrators are obviously not interested in any reconciliation, teshuva or charata.

Noone here can or should defend the indefensible.

And nothing more needs be said.
yay, does that mean you're done here?

Finally..

Offline PlatinumGuy

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1425 on: February 03, 2016, 12:42:37 PM »
Signatures were clearly artificially pasted together and I think after RSK deferred to a new special beis din these R"y would not sign
״וזה כלל גדול: שישנא אדם כל דבר שקר. וכל מה שיוסיף שנאה לדרכי השקר יוסיף אהבה לתורה.״ - אורחות צדיקים

Offline henche

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1426 on: February 03, 2016, 12:58:49 PM »
So you don't think it indicates they peddled it to 100 roshei yeshiva and got 7?

Also, why is Mr. No Daas carrying this letter under the banner "heter rescinded"? 

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1427 on: February 03, 2016, 01:15:42 PM »
Signatures were clearly artificially pasted together and I think after RSK deferred to a new special beis din these R"y would not sign
He did?

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1428 on: February 03, 2016, 01:34:11 PM »
yay, does that mean you're done here?

Finally..
What's your problem exactly?

Offline Baruch

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1429 on: February 03, 2016, 01:52:14 PM »
So you don't think it indicates they peddled it to 100 roshei yeshiva and got 7?
right. Although I'm sure there were some that wouldn't sign.

Offline Baruch

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1430 on: February 03, 2016, 01:57:21 PM »
So you don't think it indicates they peddled it to 100 roshei yeshiva and got 7?
The only signature that would indicate your theory is Rabbi Horowitz. But I don't know him so well, and there may be a reason. Rabbi Bromberg was on the 9/11 Aguna Bais Din, as was Rabbi Wachtfogel. Rabbis Shechter Wachtfogel and Kotler have signed recently on many letters together. Rabbi Miller has signed many letters on this issue already. And as previously stated, Rabbi Herskowitz is the Gadol Talmidei Rav Aharon alive (except RSK).

Offline Ergel

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1431 on: February 03, 2016, 04:12:14 PM »
I don't get what new information was revealed.
The gedolei haposkim in EY already said the heter was invalid. And some of the rabbonim signed here previously signed elsewhere. What's the big deal? That they signed together?
Life isn't about checking the boxes. Nobody cares.

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1432 on: February 03, 2016, 04:29:46 PM »
I don't get what new information was revealed.
The gedolei haposkim in EY already said the heter was invalid. And some of the rabbonim signed here previously signed elsewhere. What's the big deal? That they signed together?
It's possible that there is really more going on also.

Offline Ergel

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1433 on: February 03, 2016, 04:43:11 PM »
It's possible that there is really more going on also.
Meaning...?
Life isn't about checking the boxes. Nobody cares.

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1434 on: February 03, 2016, 04:57:43 PM »
Meaning...?
Don't know. There are rumors swirling around that the matirim are turning around...

.... I think after RSK deferred to a new special beis din these R"y would not sign
« Last Edit: February 03, 2016, 05:10:44 PM by churnbabychurn »

Offline chevron

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1435 on: February 03, 2016, 08:38:39 PM »
Also, why is Mr. No Daas carrying this letter under the banner "heter rescinded"?

Are you sitting next to me tomorrow? we can debate my heretical ideas

Offline henche

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1436 on: February 03, 2016, 08:57:09 PM »
Are you sitting next to me tomorrow? we can debate my heretical ideas

Yah yah

Offline Boruch999

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1437 on: February 08, 2016, 06:42:46 AM »
אות קצט

Offline Avrumi#1

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1438 on: March 22, 2016, 05:23:30 AM »
Rabbi Shalom Kaminetzky has retracted. He says his father also retracted.

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-E1i3yFPIoGQ/VvEA_AmBLqI/AAAAAAAAVPo/MwjBLOtbFFYPnepNoE4aWaOWQ1NdSYyPA/s640/rav-shalom-kamenetsky-letter.jpg

Will the woman and the boel separate?

Offline afro

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Re: The Tamar Epstein Saga
« Reply #1439 on: March 22, 2016, 08:15:28 AM »
Rabbi Shalom Kaminetzky has retracted. He says his father also retracted.

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-E1i3yFPIoGQ/VvEA_AmBLqI/AAAAAAAAVPo/MwjBLOtbFFYPnepNoE4aWaOWQ1NdSYyPA/s640/rav-shalom-kamenetsky-letter.jpg

Will the woman and the boel separate?

don't know if they will but they should

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