Author Topic: The Future of Lakewood  (Read 534539 times)

Offline imayid2

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4440 on: March 07, 2024, 02:46:06 PM »
We teach in the morning that Torah contains all wisdom and science, and then expect the kids to behave when theyíre being taught subjects which they see zero use for.

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4441 on: March 07, 2024, 02:46:49 PM »
I think in the end of the day, we seem to all agree that to a certain extent (everyone has their own opinion on where the yardstick ends!) there is a certain level of English thatís necessary for life, a more advanced level for specific situations/professions, which some of that info is possible to catch up on later in life. Albeit not always simple.
Then there is also information/knowledge that some would enjoy learning as an outlet or stam.
From STEM: science isnít important for the average joe, more than the very basics. Technology is usually important but I donít have information on what they supposedly teach for that subject. Engineering I also donít know what they teach, but I donít think your average shmoe needs for life. Math on the other hand seems quite necessary for every day life, though the more advanced levels usually ave case dependent.
English as a language is important just to have a normal conversation, and a more advanced level for writing.
However, once you have basic understanding of anything, you can the knowledge/information and run with it.

Offline yfr bachur

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4442 on: March 07, 2024, 02:50:58 PM »
Doesnít learning Torah have intrinsic value?

The act of learning torah, sure.
If he's making good use of the time.
If its "12 blatt in a winter zman" - not so impressive for a full second seder.
(It works out to about half a amud a day... like 15 lines of gemara/3 hours... 5 lines an hour) -

Offline imayid2

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4443 on: March 07, 2024, 02:52:33 PM »
The act of learning torah, sure.
If he's making good use of the time.
If its "12 blatt in a winter zman" - not so impressive for a full second seder.
(It works out to about half a amud a day... like 15 lines of gemara/3 hours... 5 lines an hour) -
Thatís a separate discussion, but not a valid counter argument to discussing the usefulness of secular subjects.

Offline jye

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4444 on: March 07, 2024, 02:53:13 PM »
Maybe square rooms.
Add in diagonals, convex and concave curves... No chance.
It takes me time to remember the formulas each time I need to do it (bec i dont use the skills often)
Or u can use an app

Offline yfr bachur

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4445 on: March 07, 2024, 02:55:36 PM »
Thatís a separate discussion, but not a valid counter argument to discussing the usefulness of secular subjects.

When the argument is "Secular Studies aren't useful enough to give it a certain block of time" part of the argument is what would you be alternatively be doing with said time.

Offline imayid2

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4446 on: March 07, 2024, 02:56:39 PM »
When the argument is "Secular Studies aren't useful enough to give it a certain block of time" part of the argument is what would you be alternatively be doing with said time.
Basketball
Martial arts
DD seminars


Online Sammy82

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4447 on: March 07, 2024, 02:57:52 PM »
Basketball
Martial arts
DDF seminars
Exercise? Chas v'shalom. The horrors....

Offline yfr bachur

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4448 on: March 07, 2024, 02:58:44 PM »
Basketball
Martial arts
DD seminars

I doubt there are Yeshivas in Lakewood that are foregoing Secular Studies for any of that.
Anyway, other than the last one, why are any of them useful? You aint becoming the next Lebron James or competing in some Sumo competition?

Offline imayid2

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4449 on: March 07, 2024, 03:01:22 PM »
I doubt there are Yeshivas in Lakewood that are foregoing Secular Studies for any of that.
Ok letís say they are learning. They believe all learning is immensely important and isnít measured by ďusefulnessĒ in day to day life.

Offline avromie7

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4450 on: March 07, 2024, 03:09:38 PM »
When the argument is "Secular Studies aren't useful enough to give it a certain block of time" part of the argument is what would you be alternatively be doing with said time.
Learning to waste time.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4451 on: March 07, 2024, 03:39:10 PM »
People who didnít study geometry in HS canít figure that out? I donít care if itís called geometry, you donít need to spend a year studying it for that type of basic stuff.

I didn't say you need a year to do it. There are tons of similar items with very practical applications in real life and in learning that are more complex than the area of a square.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Online yelped

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4452 on: March 07, 2024, 03:46:36 PM »
For the regular Yankel in Lakewood, can you elaborate why heís find it necessary to study natural sciences?
And math (beyond simple math).
Can't believe we are going to the level of 12 year olds here (nothing personal). Most adults have no issue understanding why it's helpful and beneficial for multiple reasons.

Offline imayid2

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4453 on: March 07, 2024, 03:50:37 PM »
Can't believe we are going to the level of 12 year olds here (nothing personal). Most adults have no issue understanding why it's helpful and beneficial for multiple reasons.
Shoin. Youíve are obviously so right that there is nothing to discuss or any points that can be made.

Offline imayid2

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4454 on: March 07, 2024, 03:54:40 PM »
I have yet to find a subject that is "useless"
::) ::)

Online yelped

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4455 on: March 07, 2024, 03:54:48 PM »
Shoin. Youíve are obviously so right that there is nothing to discuss or any points that can be made.
Lol, I let the other make their points. To argue that there is no benefit in knowing science and math beyond multiplication and division is moronic and age appropriate for a 12 year old.

Offline imayid2

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4456 on: March 07, 2024, 03:57:56 PM »
Lol, I let the other make their points. To argue that there is no benefit in knowing science and math beyond multiplication and division is moronic and age appropriate for a 12 year old.
Nice!!

Your argumentation is age appropriate for a two year old.

Shall we move on?

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4457 on: March 07, 2024, 04:00:24 PM »
Nice!!

Your argumentation is age appropriate for a two year old.

Shall we move on?
::) ::)

Offline imayid2

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4458 on: March 07, 2024, 04:03:53 PM »
Lol, I let the other make their points. To argue that there is no benefit in knowing science and math beyond multiplication and division is moronic and age appropriate for a 12 year old.
Critical thinking skills might have helped you understand the point Iím trying to make.


Do you think this way of talking is conducive?

Online Yehuda57

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #4459 on: March 07, 2024, 04:15:27 PM »
Lol, I let the other make their points. To argue that there is no benefit in knowing science and math beyond multiplication and division is moronic and age appropriate for a 12 year old.

If I argue that even if there is benefit, the harms outweigh the benefts by a long shot, is that also a moronic 12 year old position?

I'm not getting involved in a disucssion about what schools in Lakewood should or shouldn't teach, only to say that plenty who are smarter and wiser than you held more extreme positions than the ones you find moronic, and it might behoove us to calm the rhetoric a bit.

The one thing I would say IS moronic is the idea that ANY chinuch approach is equally applicable to tens of thousands of students.