Author Topic: The Future of Lakewood  (Read 207916 times)

Offline yzj

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1260 on: October 21, 2021, 09:35:08 AM »

The pumpkin picture is absolutely mind boggling. I have no idea who was in charge of the decor but this is very upsetting. It would be upsetting enough to stam walk into a frum home this time of the year and see that tablescape, but to then seat the roshei yeshiva and poskim around that table???

Yeah the other day I walked into a chasunah and they had corned beef. With all of the Rosh Yeshivas there no less. Ask any non Jew and corned beef is synonymous with St Patrickís day. היתכן?

And birthday cakes. How do frum households borrow a ritual that was started as an offering to the Greek Moon Goddess Artemis?

Artemis was the goddess of the moon (amongst other things), so on the monthly anniversary of her birthday, the Greeks would bake a round, full-moon-shaped cake in her honor. The bread-like cake was sweetened with honey, and its sweet taste was meant to imbue the occasion with pleasant sweetness they wanted to convey to their goddess. There is evidence suggesting that lighted candles were put on the cake to let the cake glow like the luminous moon.

Sometime during the Middle Ages the kinderfest tradition developed where childrenís birthdays were celebrated with cake and candles.  Before the cake was eaten, the candles were blown out as the child made a wish. The idea was that the extinguished candlesí smoke would help convey the wish up to God in heaven, to help it be fulfilled. This belief that smoke from a fire brings messages up to the heavenly gods was borrowed from earlier pagan rites.

Yet walk into most jewish houses and there is the child blowing out the candles on a birthday cake. Where is the hergesh?

And letís not even get into shlissel challah....

:)


« Last Edit: October 21, 2021, 09:54:42 AM by yzj »

Offline yuneeq

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1261 on: October 21, 2021, 09:40:10 AM »
Mods, please split the thread to:

Gourd Your Eyes, Gorge Your Mouth: how to carve yourself out of evil pumpkin and chukas hagoi holiday displays, plus delicious pumpkin pie recipes

I preferred reading -
Cheater, Cheater, Pumpkin Eater: The Story of Lakewood Corruption and the Path Towards Pagan Holiday Observance
"If you fall, I will be there." -Floor

Offline aygart

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1262 on: October 21, 2021, 09:54:29 AM »
Yeah the other day I walked into a chasunah and they had corned beef. With all of the Rosh Yeshivas there no less. Ask any non Jew and corned beef is synonymous with St Patrickís day. היתכן?

And birthday cakes. How do frum households take a ritual that was started as an offering to the Greek Moon Goddess Artemis?

Artemis was the goddess of the moon (amongst other things), so on the monthly anniversary of her birthday, the Greeks would bake a round, full-moon-shaped cake in her honor. The bread-like cake was sweetened with honey, and its sweet taste was meant to imbue the occasion with pleasant sweetness they wanted to convey to their goddess. There is evidence suggesting that lighted candles were put on the cake to let the cake glow like the luminous moon.

Sometime during the Middle Ages the kinderfest tradition developed where childrenís birthdays were celebrated with cake and candles.  Before the cake was eaten, the candles were blown out as the child made a wish. The idea was that the extinguished candlesí smoke would help convey the wish up to God in heaven, to help it be fulfilled. This belief that smoke from a fire brings messages up to the heavenly gods was borrowed from earlier pagan rites.

Yet walk into most jewish houses and there is the child blowing out the candles on a birthday cake. Where is the hergesh?

And letís not even get into shlissel challah....

:)
Making a wish while blowing out the candles is very clearly from paganism and probably chukos akum
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline yzj

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1263 on: October 21, 2021, 10:02:53 AM »
Making a wish while blowing out the candles is very clearly from paganism and probably chukos akum
As is Thanksgiving, the holiday that was established as a religious day of prayer, fasting, and atonement and only later evolved into itís current form, something Rav Moshe was quite likely unaware of.

Offline aygart

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1264 on: October 21, 2021, 10:04:08 AM »
As is Thanksgiving, the holiday that was established as a religious day of prayer, fasting, and atonement and only later evolved into itís current form, something Rav Moshe was quite likely unaware of.
Very different. Blowing candles is an obvious actual  pagan ritual.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Online yelped

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1265 on: October 21, 2021, 10:20:07 AM »
@yzj You left out the Noida Beyehuda.

Offline dasmo801

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1266 on: October 21, 2021, 11:57:20 AM »
Yeah the other day I walked into a chasunah and they had corned beef. With all of the Rosh Yeshivas there no less. Ask any non Jew and corned beef is synonymous with St Patrickís day. היתכן?

And birthday cakes. How do frum households borrow a ritual that was started as an offering to the Greek Moon Goddess Artemis?

Artemis was the goddess of the moon (amongst other things), so on the monthly anniversary of her birthday, the Greeks would bake a round, full-moon-shaped cake in her honor. The bread-like cake was sweetened with honey, and its sweet taste was meant to imbue the occasion with pleasant sweetness they wanted to convey to their goddess. There is evidence suggesting that lighted candles were put on the cake to let the cake glow like the luminous moon.

Sometime during the Middle Ages the kinderfest tradition developed where childrenís birthdays were celebrated with cake and candles.  Before the cake was eaten, the candles were blown out as the child made a wish. The idea was that the extinguished candlesí smoke would help convey the wish up to God in heaven, to help it be fulfilled. This belief that smoke from a fire brings messages up to the heavenly gods was borrowed from earlier pagan rites.

Yet walk into most jewish houses and there is the child blowing out the candles on a birthday cake. Where is the hergesh?

And letís not even get into shlissel challah....

:)

I agree with you regarding blowing out candles (or even putting candles on birthday cakes) and shlissel challah. I don't agree with the corned beef.

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1267 on: October 21, 2021, 11:59:46 AM »
I think this diversion has run its course. Time to put this discussion to bed and turn it into a pumpkin.
Quote from: ExGingi
Yehuda57 needs to spew a certain amount of sarcasm in order to survive through the day.

Offline AsherO

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1268 on: October 21, 2021, 12:01:10 PM »
I preferred reading -
Cheater, Cheater, Pumpkin Eater: The Story of Lakewood Corruption and the Path Towards Pagan Holiday Observance

עץ הדלעת טוב ורע
צלילה עמוקה בסוגיית חגי היבול בספרות חז״ל והשוואתם למנהגי עכו״ם בזה״ז

Offline Ver hut gazugt

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1269 on: October 21, 2021, 12:06:32 PM »
Yeah the other day I walked into a chasunah and they had corned beef. With all of the Rosh Yeshivas there no less. Ask any non Jew and corned beef is synonymous with St Patrickís day. היתכן?

And birthday cakes. How do frum households borrow a ritual that was started as an offering to the Greek Moon Goddess Artemis?

Artemis was the goddess of the moon (amongst other things), so on the monthly anniversary of her birthday, the Greeks would bake a round, full-moon-shaped cake in her honor. The bread-like cake was sweetened with honey, and its sweet taste was meant to imbue the occasion with pleasant sweetness they wanted to convey to their goddess. There is evidence suggesting that lighted candles were put on the cake to let the cake glow like the luminous moon.

Sometime during the Middle Ages the kinderfest tradition developed where childrenís birthdays were celebrated with cake and candles.  Before the cake was eaten, the candles were blown out as the child made a wish. The idea was that the extinguished candlesí smoke would help convey the wish up to God in heaven, to help it be fulfilled. This belief that smoke from a fire brings messages up to the heavenly gods was borrowed from earlier pagan rites.

Yet walk into most jewish houses and there is the child blowing out the candles on a birthday cake. Where is the hergesh?

And letís not even get into shlissel challah....

:)

I think there is some Nuance in this subject. Things that are used today for ďreligiousĒ purposes by goyim are much more problematic then finding out about somethings true origin that outside Wikipedia no one knows about.
One thing that is interesting to me is why we use the year 2021 even though it is clearly comes from avodah Zara. 

Offline aygart

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1270 on: October 21, 2021, 01:41:22 PM »
I think there is some Nuance in this subject. Things that are used today for ďreligiousĒ purposes by goyim are much more problematic then finding out about somethings true origin that outside Wikipedia no one knows about.
One thing that is interesting to me is why we use the year 2021 even though it is clearly comes from avodah Zara. 

I see the nuance quite differently. Making a wish while blowing out candles is something very counter to תמים תהי' and is an actual pagan ritual that went down and is now minhag avosiehem biydiehem. THere is absolutely nothing religious about using the current harvest as a decorative item at all.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline EliJelly

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1271 on: October 21, 2021, 03:11:02 PM »
One thing that is interesting to me is why we use the year 2021 even though it is clearly comes from avodah Zara.
Many are makpid to write למספרם

Offline UKinNYS

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1272 on: October 21, 2021, 05:38:20 PM »
def. wins Most Yeshivish candidate contest
Only shayla was he wearing Charles Tyrwhitt shirt?

Offline yzj

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1273 on: October 21, 2021, 06:53:33 PM »
def. wins Most Yeshivish candidate contest
Only shayla was he wearing Charles Tyrwhitt shirt?
If he didnít get them 3 for $99 he not yeshivish

Offline yesitsme

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1274 on: October 22, 2021, 12:08:12 PM »
- Gas in Lakewood averaging $3.45 a gallon, Basement apts if available going as high as $1800

Good
Bad
Crazy
Or klap on the bimah/shtender?
["-"]

Offline yzj

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1275 on: October 22, 2021, 12:17:44 PM »
Needed a change from the regular flowers for shabbos and saw these.


Offline yesitsme

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1276 on: October 22, 2021, 12:27:06 PM »

What in the world is going on in this country?
["-"]

Offline avromie7

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1277 on: October 22, 2021, 01:57:49 PM »
- Gas in Lakewood averaging $3.45 a gallon, Basement apts if available going as high as $1800

Good
Bad
Crazy
Or klap on the bimah/shtender?
Where did you see $1800? Masa U'matan is up to 3 pages, I think inventory is slowly opening up.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Online Euclid

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1278 on: October 22, 2021, 02:01:42 PM »
Where did you see $1800? Masa U'matan is up to 3 pages, I think inventory is slowly opening up.
It's a quote from hefkervelt

Offline yesitsme

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Re: The Future of Lakewood
« Reply #1279 on: October 22, 2021, 02:02:30 PM »
It's a quote from hefkervelt
my neighbor just got 1750
["-"]