FBI Raids Orthodox Homes

[thaber]

. It's been very hard to get HUD in recent years.

y'know why?

[Aaaron]

I see there are a lot of very righteous members of DDF.

Life is not binary. Life is not black and white. The vast majority of people who apply for benefits while earning more than allowable are doing so because they are desperate. They earn too much to be eligible for benefits, and at the same time do not earn enough to survive. DH, whether you like it or not, said it exactly right. Maybe he shouldn't have aired the dirty laundry of the community, but what he said is true.

I'm curious how many people here that פארקויפן זייער מיילס report it as income. I'm curious how many people here ליגענען וועגן זייער פרנסה to get approved for credit cards.

I'm not G-D forbid saying it's justified. It's not. But those who live in a glass house...

DH's statement - besides being a moronic thing to publicize - is pure BS.  Were these families living with 6 children per bedroom sleeping on mattresses on the floor?  Were they sharing a box of pasta for dinner every night?  No, they weren't.  They wanted their cake and to eat it too.  Pure greed and/or entitlement.

[aygart]

Good point. I doubt they used their own rules in determining reportable income.

FTFY

[zale]

Were these families living with 6 children per bedroom sleeping on mattresses on the floor?  Were they sharing a box of pasta for dinner every night?

The families that got arrested? No.

The vast majority of families claiming benefits while ineligible? Possibly, or possibly they don't want it to come to that.

[Dan]

The families that got arrested? No.

The vast majority of families claiming benefits while ineligible? Possibly, or possibly they don't want it to come to that.

I doubt the FBI is going to roundup people making a few thousand more than reported.
They're going after the big fish clearly.

[ilherman]

Why is cashing out a refi not income? Why is having medicaid paying a bill for you illegitimately not a benefit?

BS. They benefited illegally from Medicaid. Lets just say that medicaid had to pay for Insurance $10k per year. THIS is what they benefited illegally. Why the hell should they be charged with what the Hospital costed the Insurance company.  The Insurance policy to itself was fine. Maybe they should be charged with what the mother cooked for supper? Since its because of the medicaid that she was able to be taken care of in the Hospital, and because of the Hospital she was able to return home early, so she has to pay for everything she was able to do for the time she was home because of the Hospitals care??

[aygart]

I believe hud in Lakewood forbade that about 15 years ago

It is Fed regulations which forbade that. Someone involved showed me numbers that its effect in Lakewood was MUCH less than in many other non-frum parts of the country. It was only for direct blood relatives so a brother-in-law could still own.

[Aaaron]

I doubt the FBI is going to roundup people making a few thousand more than reported.
They're going after the big fish clearly.

Exactly.  They're not going after the one's who were "forced."  They're going after the ones they perceived were egregious violators. 

[zale]

Exactly.  They're not going after the one's who were "forced."  They're going after the ones they perceived were egregious violators.

Hopefully, but we don't know yet. Meanwhile, hundreds of families are terrified, calling and asking for amnesty...

[thaber]

BS. They benefited illegally from Medicaid. Lets just say that medicaid had to pay for Insurance $10k per year. THIS is what they benefited illegally. Why the hell should they be charged with what the Hospital costed the Insurance company.  The Insurance policy to itself was fine. Maybe they should be charged with what the mother cooked for supper? Since its because of the medicaid that she was able to be taken care of in the Hospital, and because of the Hospital she was able to return home early, so she has to pay for everything she was able to do for the time she was home because of the Hospitals care??

A) lomdus is not law
b) are you sure that's whats happening?

[aygart]

I doubt the FBI is going to roundup people making a few thousand more than reported.
They're going after the big fish clearly.

One of the families which lives not far from me is definitely living a lower income lifestyle. Maybe not 6 kids in a half bedroom and sharing a bag of beans for supper, but not a luxurious lifestyle by any means.

[Toasted]

DH's statement - besides being a moronic thing to publicize - is pure BS.  Were these families living with 6 children per bedroom sleeping on mattresses on the floor?  Were they sharing a box of pasta for dinner every night?  No, they weren't.  They wanted their cake and to eat it too.  Pure greed and/or entitlement.

I can guarantee every one of these families started taking programs when they were 100% eligible. Once you're hooked to this free money faucet, it's very difficult to stop. Almost like substance addiction, people who were recently poor have a hard time parting with their survival mindset. If we can assign some medical diagnosis to this, maybe the feds would respect their rights. If a man can feel like a girl, a prince can feel like a pauper. 🌈

[HowYaDoin]

If a man can feel like a girl, a prince can feel like a pauper. 🌈

LOVE IT

[Dan]

One of the families which lives not far from me is definitely living a lower income lifestyle. Maybe not 6 kids in a half bedroom and sharing a bag of beans for supper, but not a luxurious lifestyle by any means.

Plenty of rich people don't live a luxurious lifestyle, but what does that have to do with income?

[aygart]

Plenty of rich people don't live a luxurious lifestyle, but what does that have to do with income?

It doesn't, but I have no way of really knowing what their income is. He definitely seems like he could use the programs.

[yoohoo]

2 cents: there's a mindset in town that 'justifies' such behavior. 1) the enormous expense of a Jewish lifestyle vs. A non Jew 2) the taxes being paid for the benefits of those not contributing at all wether it's the benefits of large families that get hundreds of thousands simply bec they choose to learn and not work or the public school system (most student come from families not contributing at all to townships bottom line).....It's very lopsided. Middle class is desperate. Obviously it's illegal.

[aygart]

My grandfather had numerous conversations with R' Aharon Kotler ZTL about how the numbers would add up for kollel yungeleit. The way things are being done now have zero relation at all to R' Aharon's vision. R' Aharon had the numbers worked out. Part of his cheshbon included BMG not looking the way it does now.

[yoohoo]

Part of his cheshbon included BMG not looking the way it does now.

or Lkwd in general

[aygart]

or Lkwd in general

true that.

[jye]

When there are special needs kids involved the Medicaid dollar amounts are going to automatically be very high. That's probably what made some of these families targets....