Author Topic: Self defense  (Read 4815 times)

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Re: Self defense
« Reply #15 on: April 10, 2016, 12:32:16 PM »
cause leaving at 6pm with a friend on a shabbos walk at the age of 16 should not be allowed anymore... Oy our kids are going to become so dependent on us.

Offline chevron

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Re: Self defense
« Reply #16 on: April 10, 2016, 12:37:33 PM »
cause leaving at 6pm with a friend on a shabbos walk at the age of 16 should not be allowed anymore... Oy our kids are going to become so dependent on us.

At 16 in a foreign area on shabbat ? I think not.. with no phone or water ? or maps ?

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Self defense
« Reply #17 on: April 10, 2016, 12:42:30 PM »
Water and maps? eh. But without guns? Practically a suicide walk. Crazy.
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Offline tzifanya54

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Re: Self defense
« Reply #18 on: April 10, 2016, 01:08:10 PM »
Water and maps? eh. But without guns? Practically a suicide walk. Crazy.
Lol

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Re: Self defense
« Reply #19 on: April 10, 2016, 01:10:55 PM »
Water and maps? eh. But without guns? Practically a suicide walk. Crazy.

Are you 15? you sure are acting it... ever heard of common sense ? When I was on turks and caicos I was at some amazing deserted beaches I just wanted to jump in but did not as im not a great swimmer and it was empty

By all means go live in a bubble, its sad that we need "gedolim" to tell us that you cant swim this way or hike that way... eeeeebecause we have clowns mocking common sense

I have a bridge to sell you

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Re: Self defense
« Reply #20 on: April 10, 2016, 01:13:52 PM »
At 16 in a foreign area on shabbat ? I think not.. with no phone or water ? or maps ?

water for an hour walk? maps to walk around a couple blocks. really not that hard.

or maybe they had water and they had to pee and decided to try the swamp and couldn't get out...

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Re: Self defense
« Reply #21 on: April 10, 2016, 01:19:11 PM »
water for an hour walk? maps to walk around a couple blocks. really not that hard.

or maybe they had water and they had to pee and decided to try the swamp and couldn't get out...

Its florida, as a general rule you should not go for a walk in a foreign area here without water. BH it was not so hot the last few weeks but its still not the point

We have aligators here you know ?

This is not about this situation but about situations overall. Do you know that LEC gave its teachers concealed weapons courses ?

Thatss great but all im saying is:

Teach kids first aid, teach them self defense, teach them about various dangers etc

Go ahead and laugh, bet you would have laughed at Jabowtisnky too eh?

If I wanted to be controversial i'd debate the lack of HPV vaccinations in jewish schools

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Self defense
« Reply #22 on: April 10, 2016, 01:39:18 PM »
Are you 15? you sure are acting it... ever heard of common sense ? When I was on turks and caicos I was at some amazing deserted beaches I just wanted to jump in but did not as im not a great swimmer and it was empty

By all means go live in a bubble, its sad that we need "gedolim" to tell us that you cant swim this way or hike that way... eeeeebecause we have clowns mocking common sense

I have a bridge to sell you

Obviously what they did, and we still don't know the details, was insanely dangerous, and should have been warned against by the staff. They may well have ignored explicit instructions, they may not have been properly warned, they may have mistakenly gone in a wrong direction - no one knows yet, an perhaps we may never know. And that is fine.

What you are doing is fear mongering. We are living in an historically safe time. Yes, tragedies have happened, and will happen. By all means, kids should be taught of the dangers that may surround them. But you make it sound like girls are being abducted and abused on a regular basis, when it is not even rare, it is unheard of.
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Offline sky121

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Re: Self defense
« Reply #23 on: April 10, 2016, 01:50:24 PM »
That's where you're wrong. Unheard of perhaps because people tend not to talk. Girls have gotten raped in many communities over the years. Yes it doesn't happen often.
Neither do plane crashes. Doesn't mean you shouldn't wear your buckle. Right? There has to be a balance.
"Not all who wander are lost"

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Re: Self defense
« Reply #24 on: April 10, 2016, 01:55:55 PM »
who said they weren't taught about various dangers?

I am actually more on your side then I am coming across because I think you are going to a major extreme here. Teach your kids to be safe, teach them about dangers, teach them about alligators, teach them how to handle someone touching them inappropriately, teach them to have a buddy when going in new locations and exploring, and then let them go and make mistakes and learn the same way you did (hopefully nowhere near as drastic as last nights situation which B'H ended up working out ok) while you daven that Hashem should help them.

But don't raise your kids to be paranoid and be afraid to step outside without a hired security guard. Don't raise your kids that the dangers in the world mean they can't enjoy the world. Don't raise them to never step outside their comfort zone.

Oh and FTR I have worked security and I would carry a gun to protect my family and my community, but I would also let my daughter go with a friend to walk for an hour on shabbos afternoon if I felt they could be trusted to return well before dark and I was comfortable with the neighborhood where they were walking.

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Re: Self defense
« Reply #25 on: April 10, 2016, 01:59:46 PM »
That's where you're wrong. Unheard of perhaps because people tend not to talk. Girls have gotten raped in many communities over the years. Yes it doesn't happen often.
Neither do plane crashes. Doesn't mean you shouldn't wear your buckle. Right? There has to be a balance.
Don't mean to nitpick but if you're  concerned about plane crashes don't go on a plane as the buckle won't help much.
Rape in our community by a person previously unknown is probably  as statistically prevlent as a plane crash. Most people have no problem boarding a plane.
If you focus on being a boss, you will never be a leader. Leaders lead people to growth and improvement.

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Re: Self defense
« Reply #26 on: April 10, 2016, 02:07:46 PM »
Are you implying Jewish girls don't go online and meet random guys and hook up? The story of the guy in France is terrifying.

I read about missing kids on vin all the time, I bet we don't get the real story

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Re: Self defense
« Reply #27 on: April 10, 2016, 02:07:57 PM »
That's where you're wrong. Unheard of perhaps because people tend not to talk. Girls have gotten raped in many communities over the years. Yes it doesn't happen often.
Neither do plane crashes. Doesn't mean you shouldn't wear your buckle. Right? There has to be a balance.
So by comparing it to plane crashes, you're agreeing with me.
I didn't say not to educate and take precautions. But when girls get lost in a heavily wooded swampland and you use that as a springboard to speak about frum girls needing to carry mace, perhaps you're fear mongering.
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Offline sky121

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Re: Self defense
« Reply #28 on: April 10, 2016, 02:11:46 PM »
So by comparing it to plane crashes, you're agreeing with me.
I didn't say not to educate and take precautions. But when girls get lost in a heavily wooded swampland and you use that as a springboard to speak about frum girls needing to carry mace, perhaps you're fear mongering.

No one knew what happened to them and thank G-d they just got lost but the story could have easily ended much more. Stories end much worse all the time. Bad things happen. All the time.

Woman could carry mace especially in various situations. And should definitely learn self defense.

Boys should too.

Things happen enough that it's worth learning. Why shouldn't an individual know how to protect themselves in this day and age?
"Not all who wander are lost"

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Re: Self defense
« Reply #29 on: April 10, 2016, 02:13:57 PM »
who said they weren't taught about various dangers?

I am actually more on your side then I am coming across because I think you are going to a major extreme here. Teach your kids to be safe, teach them about dangers, teach them about alligators, teach them how to handle someone touching them inappropriately, teach them to have a buddy when going in new locations and exploring, and then let them go and make mistakes and learn the same way you did (hopefully nowhere near as drastic as last nights situation which B'H ended up working out ok) while you daven that Hashem should help them.

But don't raise your kids to be paranoid and be afraid to step outside without a hired security guard. Don't raise your kids that the dangers in the world mean they can't enjoy the world. Don't raise them to never step outside their comfort zone.

Oh and FTR I have worked security and I would carry a gun to protect my family and my community, but I would also let my daughter go with a friend to walk for an hour on shabbos afternoon if I felt they could be trusted to return well before dark and I was comfortable with the neighborhood where they were walking.

Like I said. There has to be balance.
"Not all who wander are lost"