Women's role in judaism

[good sam]

Woman are pre designed the way Hashem wanted them. I've heard someone joke that if women make sheasani keritzono, men should make a sheasani shelo keritzono. There is some truth to this joke. Men make the brachah that they have the extra work mitzvos. Women make the brachah that they are closer to Retzono than men are. By thanking Hashem for the extra work (in making a shelo asani isha), we are essentially saying Baruch Sheasani Shelo Keritzono.

Nice explanation. Never heard it before.

[JTZ]

Who created the poll, Cruz? Two choices for men, that's fair. 

[ExGingi]

I was up way too late cleaning last night...

Isn't that the woman's job 

[JTZ]

Isn't that the woman's job 

Yes but she told him to do it. 

[David Smith]

Isn't that the woman's job 

Who says I'm a male?

[JTZ]

Who says I'm a male?

I am. 

[Baruch]

Honestly, it always bothered me somewhat and the often repeated answers that men have more Mitzvos never satisfied the question, because then they'd say a bracha thanking Hashem for that, no need to make anyone look bad.

Now I see it as superior and inferior are relative words, and it doesn't bother me as much. We all have our unique missions to fulfill. That being said, men usually do assume a more dominant position in this world. But dominant doesn't necessarily mean superior.

Can anybody (Lubavitchers) back me up? I believe I've heard something to the effect of when Moshiach comes "the female spirit will be greater than the male."

I also thought that the "mitzvah" explanation, was made up just to conform the bracha with western values. And then I saw that Rashi explains it that way. And he wasn't trying to conform with society. And if your not sure if he was trying to conform with society, look at his other pshat!

[sguitarist18]

Actually, when you think about it for a few minutes, to me at least it seems obvious that this is the simple understanding. Otherwise, what kind of bracha are women making? "Uh, yeah, God, you made me inferior, and it's pretty awful, but that's what you wanted, so thanks!"

Even if Judaism was misogynistic, that's a petty strange bracha. In this context, it makes sense - men are thanking hashem for giving them more opportunities to perfect themselves and grow, women are thanking hashem for making them closer to the ideal.

Furthermore, the concept that women are created closer to perfection matches many other concepts in judaism.

[churnbabychurn]

The whole discussion is ludicrous. -(don't take it personally)
It is based on a ridiculous and patently false premise that males and females are the somehow the same.

Men and women are totally different beings. There is no issue of inferiority when two beings are not even in the same race.

What's better a car or a tree??

I am happy as a man and woman are happy as woman. Only the mentaly ill are unhappy with their gender.

Everyone else should thank GD for creating them as he did.

[sky121]

The whole discussion is ludicrous. -(don't take it personally)
It is based on a ridiculous and patently false premise that males and females are the somehow the same.

Men and women are totally different beings. There is no issue of inferiority when two beings are not even in the same race.

What's better a car or a tree??

I am happy as a man and woman are happy as woman. Only the mentaly ill are unhappy with their gender.

Everyone else should thank GD for creating them as he did.

No one was getting into this at all. The question isn't if you're happy. It's if one is superior over the other. And what that even means.

At the end of the day it's hard to  argue that the Bracha isn't written a bit interesting.

[churnbabychurn]

No one was getting into this at all. The question isn't if you're happy. It's if one is superior over the other. And what that even means.

At the end of the day it's hard to  argue that the Bracha isn't written a bit interesting.

You ignored my main point.

What is superior a car or a tree?

[sky121]

You ignored my main point.

What is superior a car or a tree?

 A tree.

[churnbabychurn]

A tree.

Poor car. It should start a movement.

[joe1234]

You ignored my main point.

What is superior a car or a tree?

ice cream because it has no bones 

[sky121]

Poor car. It should start a movement.

See? The issue is you're taking the question already assuming that it's not ok if Women aren't superior and that women have issue with it and the issues with woman wanting more equality in Judiasm.

The problem is no one was talking about any of those things. No one was focusing on that aspect.


All I heard was a question of - are men superior? And why was the bracha written in such an interesting way?
That's it.

[churnbabychurn]

See? The issue is you're taking the question already assuming that it's not ok if Women aren't superior and that women have issue with it and the issues with woman wanting more equality in Judiasm.

The problem is no one was talking about any of those things. No one was focusing on that aspect.


All I heard was a question of - are men superior? And why was the bracha written in such an interesting way?
That's it.

I'm saying there is nothing "funny" about the brocha.
There is something funny though about cars wanting to be trees.

[sky121]

I'm saying there is nothing "funny" about the brocha.
There is something funny though about cars wanting to be trees.

It is written in an odd way.
And there IS something funny about cars wanting to be trees. But no one was talking about that.

[joe1234]

who usually has a higher salary and better job?
who is more respected in todays world?
who is more dominant in todays world?
i think that its obvious that men are superior in todays world whether you like it or not. 

[chevron]

DDF is 76% male

[sky121]

who usually has a higher salary and better job?
who is more respected in todays world?
who is more dominant in todays world?
i think that its obvious that men are superior in todays world whether you like it or not. 

What does superior even mean though in terms of spiritual beings?

The examples you gave above were of a different variety. And I'd think most people would generally agree.