Author Topic: EL AL  (Read 132720 times)

Online Kobe Bryant

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Re: EL AL
« Reply #1215 on: September 23, 2020, 02:27:11 PM »
Now picked up in Globes
https://www.globes.co.il/news/article.aspx?did=1001343653
אלדון שדלסון
הרגע

יש גבול לחוצפה שלך. כשלת בניהול החברה עם שכר הטייסים. 700 טייסים ל 40 מטוסים. התבלבלת??? ושכר מנופח. אחרי שהפלת תחברה לפני פשיטת רגל. בא איש עסקים שמוכן לשים כסף כשאת לא מוכנה לשים שקל אחד בהנפקה הוא כן שם. למה שהמדינה תשב ותממן תכשלונות שלך על חשבון האזרחים. את מוזמנת לעזוב תחברה כמו נוחי דנקר שעזב את אי די בי. ועוד אנשי עסקים שנפלו. המדינה לא אמורה לממן אותך

Offline tavster

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Re: EL AL
« Reply #1216 on: September 23, 2020, 02:31:52 PM »
אלדון שדלסון
הרגע

יש גבול לחוצפה שלך. כשלת בניהול החברה עם שכר הטייסים. 700 טייסים ל 40 מטוסים. התבלבלת??? ושכר מנופח. אחרי שהפלת תחברה לפני פשיטת רגל. בא איש עסקים שמוכן לשים כסף כשאת לא מוכנה לשים שקל אחד בהנפקה הוא כן שם. למה שהמדינה תשב ותממן תכשלונות שלך על חשבון האזרחים. את מוזמנת לעזוב תחברה כמו נוחי דנקר שעזב את אי די בי. ועוד אנשי עסקים שנפלו. המדינה לא אמורה לממן אותך
Well said.
If I was a shareholder I would sue the board for failing on its fiduciary duties

Online ExGingi

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Re: EL AL
« Reply #1217 on: September 24, 2020, 08:34:44 AM »
Well said.
If I was a shareholder I would sue the board for failing on its fiduciary duties

Any precedent for legal accountability of a board in Israel?
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline shaulyaakov

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Re: EL AL
« Reply #1218 on: September 24, 2020, 08:47:08 AM »
This may be an unpopular opinion here, but we all know the Kenny was behind this from the beginning. Heck, DDMS reported that numerous times. To me, that leaves 2 questions:

1. Was the holding company funded through an above board loan? That would generally require certain legal documents to exist, including things like paying interest at prevailing rates etc?

2. Even if it was all technically legal, since the Knesset has some discretion here, should they care if it's more of a "wink wink" sort of thing? Presumably, the government doesn't want to be on the hook for all these shares, so I imagine they wouldn't care unless there are serious irregularities here.

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Re: EL AL
« Reply #1219 on: September 24, 2020, 08:51:57 AM »
This may be an unpopular opinion here, but we all know the Kenny was behind this from the beginning. Heck, DDMS reported that numerous times. To me, that leaves 2 questions:

1. Was the holding company funded through an above board loan? That would generally require certain legal documents to exist, including things like paying interest at prevailing rates etc?

2. Even if it was all technically legal, since the Knesset has some discretion here, should they care if it's more of a "wink wink" sort of thing? Presumably, the government doesn't want to be on the hook for all these shares, so I imagine they wouldn't care unless there are serious irregularities here.

1. Are you aware of what AFR rates currently are?
2. They have the option to care or not care.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline shaulyaakov

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Re: EL AL
« Reply #1220 on: September 24, 2020, 08:53:31 AM »
1. Are you aware of what AFR rates currently are?
2. They have the option to care or not care.
For a risky investment opportunity to buy a failing airline? Guessing pretty high.

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Re: EL AL
« Reply #1221 on: September 24, 2020, 08:57:45 AM »
For a risky investment opportunity to buy a failing airline? Guessing pretty high.

What does that have to do with AFR (applicable federal rates)?

https://resources.evans-legal.com/?p=2591
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline shaulyaakov

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Re: EL AL
« Reply #1222 on: September 24, 2020, 09:01:16 AM »
What does that have to do with AFR (applicable federal rates)?

https://resources.evans-legal.com/?p=2591
Is that the only applicable factor for Israel's requirements? I'm asking - I genuinely don't know.

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Re: EL AL
« Reply #1223 on: September 24, 2020, 10:09:47 AM »
Is that the only applicable factor for Israel's requirements? I'm asking - I genuinely don't know.

That differentiates between a loan and a gift (or some other proxy arrangement which isn't an arms-length transaction) based on US law (which both Kenny and Eli are subject to). I would assume it would be respected by Israeli law. I.e. if there's a proper loan document charging AFR rates, it's a legitimate bona fide loan (if it's a gift then it would be subject to US gift taxes. I'm sure someone with the net worth of Kenny Rozenberg has proper advice in order to make sure all the i's are dotted and all the t's are crossed).
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline tavster

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Re: EL AL
« Reply #1224 on: September 24, 2020, 12:40:09 PM »
Rosenberg's lawyers respond to the allegations. Call them lies.
My favorite quote: "The Borowitz Group appears to be illegally using EL AL's name for its own purposes that are inconsistent with EL AL's goals, with some board members making cynical use of their formal authority. "

https://passportnews.co.il/%D7%9B%D7%A0%D7%A4%D7%99-%D7%A0%D7%A9%D7%A8%D7%99%D7%9D-%D7%AA%D7%A2%D7%95%D7%A4%D7%94-%D7%91%D7%9E%D7%9B%D7%AA%D7%91-%D7%97%D7%A8%D7%99%D7%A3-%D7%9C%D7%97%D7%91%D7%A8%D7%99-%D7%93%D7%99%D7%A8/

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Re: EL AL
« Reply #1225 on: September 24, 2020, 01:31:49 PM »
Rosenberg's lawyers respond to the allegations. Call them lies.
My favorite quote: "The Borowitz Group appears to be illegally using EL AL's name for its own purposes that are inconsistent with EL AL's goals, with some board members making cynical use of their formal authority. "

https://passportnews.co.il/%D7%9B%D7%A0%D7%A4%D7%99-%D7%A0%D7%A9%D7%A8%D7%99%D7%9D-%D7%AA%D7%A2%D7%95%D7%A4%D7%94-%D7%91%D7%9E%D7%9B%D7%AA%D7%91-%D7%97%D7%A8%D7%99%D7%A3-%D7%9C%D7%97%D7%91%D7%A8%D7%99-%D7%93%D7%99%D7%A8/

While on that site I saw another interesting news item:

https://passportnews.co.il/%d7%99%d7%a9%d7%a8%d7%90%d7%99%d7%99%d7%a8-%d7%a6%d7%a4%d7%95%d7%99%d7%94-%d7%9c%d7%94%d7%99%d7%9e%d7%9b%d7%a8-%d7%aa%d7%95%d7%9a-%d7%97%d7%95%d7%93%d7%a9%d7%99%d7%99%d7%9d-%d7%91%d7%9e%d7%9b%d7%a8/

Looks like Israir might be on the sales block soon.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline tavster

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Re: EL AL
« Reply #1226 on: September 24, 2020, 01:33:42 PM »
Saw that yesterday since I follow IDB quite closely.
Didn't think anyone here would care  :)

Offline ae123

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Re: EL AL
« Reply #1227 on: September 28, 2020, 11:27:31 PM »
Is the 125% voucher only able to be redeemed on El Al's site?
If yes, that poses a problem as I'll explain.

Often tickets are significantly cheaper on 3rd part sites than El Al's site.
For example, we purchased El Al tickets on Momondo for last August at $1100 each while on El Al's site those same tickets were $1500 each.
Hence, if the 125% voucher can only be used on El Al's site we will actually be taking quite a loss.

Am I missing something?
Thanks.

Offline yandmk

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Re: EL AL
« Reply #1228 on: September 28, 2020, 11:34:32 PM »
Is the 125% voucher only able to be redeemed on El Al's site?
If yes, that poses a problem as I'll explain.

Often tickets are significantly cheaper on 3rd part sites than El Al's site.
For example, we purchased El Al tickets on Momondo for last August at $1100 each while on El Al's site those same tickets were $1500 each.
Hence, if the 125% voucher can only be used on El Al's site we will actually be taking quite a loss.

Am I missing something?
Thanks.
So go for the refund

Offline tavster

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Re: EL AL
« Reply #1229 on: September 29, 2020, 10:46:54 AM »