Author Topic: Silent Killer  (Read 213582 times)

Offline hvaces42

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Nov 2013
  • Posts: 5588
  • Total likes: 1148
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 14
    • View Profile
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #360 on: September 08, 2016, 10:23:38 AM »
Maybe she is just trying to say how addictive and horrific heroin is. Maybe she is just trying to make more aware of this problem. Maybe she has seen this all to often and does not know where to turn.
I think you need to reread it
Fair warning - Any PMs sent in response to forum posts are fair game for ridicule in public.

Offline hvaces42

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Nov 2013
  • Posts: 5588
  • Total likes: 1148
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 14
    • View Profile
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #361 on: September 08, 2016, 10:25:51 AM »
He's right. In the original, it is spelled "heroine". Seems like she thinks they are spelled and pronounced the same and her poem is based on that.
+1

And the naiveté of that misconception is the basis for not appreciating the dangers of the drug.

This is actually very constructive and instructive.
Fair warning - Any PMs sent in response to forum posts are fair game for ridicule in public.

Offline Boruch999

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jun 2014
  • Posts: 1929
  • Total likes: 186
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #362 on: September 08, 2016, 10:40:11 AM »
I don't believe she was trying to convey any particular potent message.
Just voicing her unfathomable grief and frustration.
I was never good at deciphering poetry so please enlighten me as to the message here.
Isbit an Ode to the fallacies of heroin's promises?
That's how I took it.


I think you need to reread it
He's right. In the original, it is spelled "heroine". Seems like she thinks they are spelled and pronounced the same and her poem is based on that.
Its a form of expression thats open to interpretation.

Thats what i got when I read it.  can reread it all day long. It does not tell ME anything more than I have written.

So please share what you've gotten from it. Or dont.
+1

And the naiveté of that misconception is the basis for not appreciating the dangers of the drug.

This is actually very constructive and instructive.
This is why I'm not into poetry.

Offline yuneeq

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jan 2013
  • Posts: 8611
  • Total likes: 3999
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 10
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: NJ
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #363 on: September 08, 2016, 10:43:11 AM »
He's right. In the original, it is spelled "heroine". Seems like she thinks they are spelled and pronounced the same and her poem is based on that.

She spelled it both ways.
Sorry but you need to read it again if you can't understand how she uses it as a double entendre.

Maybe there's nothing good that comes out of reading the poem but if it made her feel a little better than good for her.
Visibly Jewish

Offline hvaces42

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Nov 2013
  • Posts: 5588
  • Total likes: 1148
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 14
    • View Profile
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #364 on: September 08, 2016, 10:47:27 AM »
She spelled it both ways.
Sorry but you need to read it again if you can't understand how she uses it as a double entendre.

Maybe there's nothing good that comes out of reading the poem but if it made her feel a little better than good for her.
Conflation is not Double entendre

Fair warning - Any PMs sent in response to forum posts are fair game for ridicule in public.

Offline yuneeq

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jan 2013
  • Posts: 8611
  • Total likes: 3999
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 10
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: NJ
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #365 on: September 08, 2016, 10:57:52 AM »
Conflation is not Double entendre

She didn't conflate anything. Everything was used correctly.
Point to one part where it was conflated.
Visibly Jewish

Online jj1000

  • Administrator
  • Dansdeals Lifetime 10K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • **********
  • Join Date: Jun 2008
  • Posts: 13472
  • Total likes: 6096
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 29367
    • View Profile
  • Location: The value of a forum such as this one is not in that one can post a question and receive an answer, but in that the question has most likely been asked before, and the answer is available to him that will but only use the search function.
  • Programs: 1. Search on google. 2. Search in the right board of DDF with a general word or two. 3. Read the wiki. 4. Read the thread. 5. Ask away.
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #366 on: September 08, 2016, 11:22:13 AM »
@hvaces42

If you don't get poetry than just say that, you are sounding really silly to me.

It's a beautiful poem, and yes I love poetry so maybe I'm biased. The beauty is that is is open to interpretation and allows the reader to take it to heart or not depending on how they read it and understand it, it can be much more powerful than a simply stated idea.

Before I give my interpretation I just want to say that I don't understand how you can say words words words when the main call for action that you are suggesting here is education, and how exactly is education done? "Words words words."

Words are one of the most powerful forces in the world, you will never get anywhere without using them, insulting them doesn't sound very smart to me.

Anyway with that said the poem to me is coming from a girl who is living in a similar situation, the author had a tough childhood with no one to look up to. She is an adult now and can do what she wants, many of her friends from similar backgrounds take heroin and claim that it saved them and changed their life from miserable to wonderful. Yet she has held off the easy path and been working hard to avoid it.

Being that she never had a good role model to look up to she and her friends see heroin as a heroine that can take them out of their sad life and make them instantly happy.

After a few friends being killed from heroin she is realizing it's not time to blame the person or say how good a person they were, it's time to realize that heroin is no heroine at all but rather a filthy lying scumbag who just like an abusive husband, promises to give her the world but really all it does it destroy it.

I think for someone who was considering heroin this can be very educational and a good read.

Hope that makes some sense no time to look over what I wrote atm.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2016, 11:27:29 AM by jj1000 »
See my 5 step program to your left <--

(Real signature under my location)

Offline yuneeq

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jan 2013
  • Posts: 8611
  • Total likes: 3999
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 10
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: NJ
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #367 on: September 08, 2016, 11:25:27 AM »
@hvaces42

If you don't get poetry than just say that, you are sounding really silly to me.

It's a beautiful poem, and yes I love poetry so maybe I'm biased. The beauty is that is is open to interpretation and allows the reader to take it to heart or not depending on how they read it and understand it, it can be much more powerful than a simply stated idea.

Before I give my interpretation I just want to say that I don't understand how you can say words words words when the main call for action that you are suggesting here is education, and how exactly is education done? "Words words words."

Words one of the most powerful forces in the world, you will never get anywhere without using them, insulting them doesn't sound very smart to me.

Anyway with that said the poem to me is coming from a girl who is living in a similar situation, the author had a tough childhood with no one to look up to. She is an adult now and can do what she wants, many of her friends from similar backgrounds take heroin and claim that it saved them and changed their life from miserable to wonderful. Yet she has held off the easy path and been working hard to avoid it.

Being that she never had a good role model to look up to she and her friends see heroin as a heroine that can take them out of their sad life and make them instantly happy.

After a few friends being killed from heroin she is realizing it's not time to blame the person or say how good a person they were, it's time to realize that heroin is no heroine at all but rather a filthy lying scumbag who just like an abusive husband, promises to give her the world but really all it does it destroy it.

I think for someone who was considering heroin this can be very educational and a good read.

Hope that makes some sense no time to look over what I wrote atm.

Well said and FTFY
Visibly Jewish

Offline JTZ

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Apr 2016
  • Posts: 1884
  • Total likes: 230
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 1
    • View Profile
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #368 on: September 08, 2016, 11:27:05 AM »
Hope that makes some sense no time to look over what I wrote atm.
Words words words.  :P

Of course it makes sense.
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline hvaces42

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Nov 2013
  • Posts: 5588
  • Total likes: 1148
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 14
    • View Profile
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #369 on: September 08, 2016, 11:29:58 AM »
@hvaces42

If you don't get poetry than just say that, you are sounding really silly to me.

It's a beautiful poem, and yes I love poetry so maybe I'm biased. The beauty is that is is open to interpretation and allows the reader to take it to heart or not depending on how they read it and understand it, it can be much more powerful than a simply stated idea.

Before I give my interpretation I just want to say that I don't understand how you can say words words words when the main call for action that you are suggesting here is education, and how exactly is education done? "Words words words."

Words are one of the most powerful forces in the world, you will never get anywhere without using them, insulting them doesn't sound very smart to me.

Anyway with that said the poem to me is coming from a girl who is living in a similar situation, the author had a tough childhood with no one to look up to. She is an adult now and can do what she wants, many of her friends from similar backgrounds take heroin and claim that it saved them and changed their life from miserable to wonderful. Yet she has held off the easy path and been working hard to avoid it.

Being that she never had a good role model to look up to she and her friends see heroin as a heroine that can take them out of their sad life and make them instantly happy.

After a few friends being killed from heroin she is realizing it's not time to blame the person or say how good a person they were, it's time to realize that heroin is no heroine at all but rather a filthy lying scumbag who just like an abusive husband, promises to give her the world but really all it does it destroy it.

I think for someone who was considering heroin this can be very educational and a good read.

Hope that makes some sense no time to look over what I wrote atm.
I was never good at deciphering poetry so please enlighten me as to the message here.
Isbit an Ode to the fallacies of heroin's promises?
Fair warning - Any PMs sent in response to forum posts are fair game for ridicule in public.

Offline JayR

  • Dansdeals Platinum Elite + Lifetime Silver Elite
  • *****
  • Join Date: Dec 2014
  • Posts: 734
  • Total likes: 9
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 4
    • View Profile
  • Location: The City That Never Sleeps
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #370 on: September 08, 2016, 12:05:29 PM »
Maybe she is just trying to say how addictive and horrific heroin is. Maybe she is just trying to make more aware of this problem. Maybe she has seen this all to often and does not know where to turn.
+1000
You can modify your original post. The modify button is right next to the quote button.

Offline elya

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jan 2015
  • Posts: 2378
  • Total likes: 96
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 1
    • View Profile
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #371 on: September 08, 2016, 12:31:27 PM »
@hvaces42

If you don't get poetry than just say that, you are sounding really silly to me.

It's a beautiful poem, and yes I love poetry so maybe I'm biased. The beauty is that is is open to interpretation and allows the reader to take it to heart or not depending on how they read it and understand it, it can be much more powerful than a simply stated idea.

Before I give my interpretation I just want to say that I don't understand how you can say words words words when the main call for action that you are suggesting here is education, and how exactly is education done? "Words words words."

Words are one of the most powerful forces in the world, you will never get anywhere without using them, insulting them doesn't sound very smart to me.

Anyway with that said the poem to me is coming from a girl who is living in a similar situation, the author had a tough childhood with no one to look up to. She is an adult now and can do what she wants, many of her friends from similar backgrounds take heroin and claim that it saved them and changed their life from miserable to wonderful. Yet she has held off the easy path and been working hard to avoid it.

Being that she never had a good role model to look up to she and her friends see heroin as a heroine that can take them out of their sad life and make them instantly happy.

After a few friends being killed from heroin she is realizing it's not time to blame the person or say how good a person they were, it's time to realize that heroin is no heroine at all but rather a filthy lying scumbag who just like an abusive husband, promises to give her the world but really all it does it destroy it.

I think for someone who was considering heroin this can be very educational and a good read.

Hope that makes some sense no time to look over what I wrote atm.
I appreciate the very eloquent interpretation. Thank you.

Offline elit

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jun 2008
  • Posts: 1349
  • Total likes: 119
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #372 on: November 23, 2016, 08:30:01 PM »

Online jj1000

  • Administrator
  • Dansdeals Lifetime 10K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • **********
  • Join Date: Jun 2008
  • Posts: 13472
  • Total likes: 6096
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 29367
    • View Profile
  • Location: The value of a forum such as this one is not in that one can post a question and receive an answer, but in that the question has most likely been asked before, and the answer is available to him that will but only use the search function.
  • Programs: 1. Search on google. 2. Search in the right board of DDF with a general word or two. 3. Read the wiki. 4. Read the thread. 5. Ask away.
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #373 on: November 29, 2016, 02:07:12 PM »
See my 5 step program to your left <--

(Real signature under my location)

Offline coralsnake

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 4555
  • Total likes: 162
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 9
    • View Profile
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #374 on: November 29, 2016, 02:26:02 PM »
"Here at DansDeals we don’t do buses." -Dan

Offline hvaces42

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Nov 2013
  • Posts: 5588
  • Total likes: 1148
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 14
    • View Profile
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #375 on: November 29, 2016, 04:13:06 PM »
I did.

Very well written and I totally agree.
+1000

This topic is very near and dear to me.

Let's start with taking away the stigma of getting help. Whether it be from therapy (which is basically useless for addicts) to, rehab, to 12 step programs.

AA, NA, GA, SA are life saving programs which i am familiar with.  The most common "excuse" is "oh its held in a church". Go to church for heavens sake, just get help in stopping your addiction.

Addiction wreaks havoc on the addict, their family and ultimately on the community at large. We as frum people must accept that its a real issue and allow our addicts the time and space to recover.

There is real recovery out there. Most recovered addicts lead very successful fulfilling lives. There is hope.
Fair warning - Any PMs sent in response to forum posts are fair game for ridicule in public.

Offline yochiek93

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Apr 2015
  • Posts: 4456
  • Total likes: 92
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 3
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #376 on: November 29, 2016, 04:20:01 PM »
+1000

This topic is very near and dear to me.

Let's start with taking away the stigma of getting help. Whether it be from therapy (which is basically useless for addicts) to, rehab, to 12 step programs.

AA, NA, GA, SA are life saving programs which i am familiar with.  The most common "excuse" is "oh its held in a church". Go to church for heavens sake, just get help in stopping your addiction.

Addiction wreaks havoc on the addict, their family and ultimately on the community at large. We as frum people must accept that its a real issue and allow our addicts the time and space to recover.

There is real recovery out there. Most recovered addicts lead very successful fulfilling lives. There is hope.
How about for those that are uncomfortable going to churches to have it in a neutral setting where they are willing to go

Offline hvaces42

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Nov 2013
  • Posts: 5588
  • Total likes: 1148
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 14
    • View Profile
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #377 on: November 29, 2016, 04:27:57 PM »
How about for those that are uncomfortable going to churches to have it in a neutral setting where they are willing to go
1. Thats where the meetings are held.
2. If the stigma of going to meetings wouldnt be there then The frum community could set aside space for meetings in their public places.
3. An addict is never willing to go until it is usually late in the game and they have a lot on the line. So making them comfortable shouldnt be a high priority.
4. Do every sin in the book and them claim to be too frum to go to a church owned social hall is the height of hypocrisy.
5. The meetings are not held in the church sanctuary. They are usually held in ancillary facilities. If you need a heter to go there go ask your LOR. If he doesnt give it to you i will take your place in gehinom.
Fair warning - Any PMs sent in response to forum posts are fair game for ridicule in public.

Offline Emkay

  • Dansdeals Lifetime 10K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Dec 2012
  • Posts: 14295
  • Total likes: 376
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 35
    • View Profile
  • Location: Where I ought to be
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #378 on: November 29, 2016, 04:32:54 PM »
1. Thats where the meetings are held.
2. If the stigma of going to meetings wouldnt be there then The frum community could set aside space for meetings in their public places.
3. An addict is never willing to go until it is usually late in the game and they have a lot on the line. So making them comfortable shouldnt be a high priority.
4. Do every sin in the book and them claim to be too frum to go to a church owned social hall is the height of hypocrisy.
5. The meetings are not held in the church sanctuary. They are usually held in ancillary facilities. If you need a heter to go there go ask your LOR. If he doesnt give it to you i will take your place in gehinom.
None of those really answered the issue.

Offline aygart

  • Dansdeals Lifetime 10K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 17399
  • Total likes: 14339
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 14
    • View Profile
    • Lower Watt Energy Brokers
  • Programs: www.lowerwatt.com
Re: Silent Killer
« Reply #379 on: November 29, 2016, 04:40:13 PM »
One important aspect that many people miss regarding these issues is contagion. We keep hearing over and over again how important awareness is, and in many ways it is true. On the other hand though, publicizing these issues has its own pitfalls. It has been shown that the more publicized a suicide is the more copycat cases there are. When there is a high profile celebrity suicide there has been shown to be a noticeable rise in the suicide rate. As such much care must be taken to not work so hard to fix the issue that it only gets made worse. This is a very fine line to toe. It would be a shame for people with the best intentions to help solve this issue to unknowing actually cause it to get worse.
Feelings don't care about your facts