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« Last edited by yesitsme on August 23, 2018, 02:21:17 PM »

Author Topic: Take Back Lakewood  (Read 259289 times)

Offline avromie7

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Re: Take Back Lakewood
« Reply #2235 on: June 27, 2017, 08:56:11 PM »


Was not referring to these people. Was referring to the insinuation that these people are representative of an entire community.
" it's outrageous that law enforcement is trying to paint a picture of an entire community that is rolling in it and padding their pockets with cash from programs when it's is a very very small minority who are really well off and taking programs"

+1000 it's a very small minority who is taking programs eventhough they don't need it. In a frum home the poverty level is a lot higher than a non frum household, just tuition itself is a huge burden that even those making a "decent income" have a hard time affording it.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Offline aygart

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Re: Take Back Lakewood
« Reply #2236 on: June 27, 2017, 09:08:57 PM »

+1000 it's a very small minority who is taking programs eventhough they don't need it. In a frum home the poverty level is a lot higher than a non frum household, just tuition itself is a huge burden that even those making a "decent income" have a hard time affording it.
Also with large families come larger houses.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline avromie7

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Re: Take Back Lakewood
« Reply #2237 on: June 27, 2017, 09:10:31 PM »
Also with large families come larger houses.
That's already built into the federal poverty line because it increases for each member of the houshold.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Offline aygart

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Re: Take Back Lakewood
« Reply #2238 on: June 27, 2017, 09:11:51 PM »
That's already built into the federal poverty line because it increases for each member of the houshold.
Yet they speak about someone living in a 15 year old townhouse currenly assessed at 400k like they are in the lap of luxury
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: Take Back Lakewood
« Reply #2239 on: June 27, 2017, 10:43:56 PM »

+1000 it's a very small minority who is taking programs eventhough they don't need it. In a frum home the poverty level is a lot higher than a non frum household, just tuition itself is a huge burden that even those making a "decent income" have a hard time affording it.
The federal poverty limits don't change due to private school tuition costs.

There are no two sets of rules, and apparently, these sevoros and pilpulim to rationalize why people are really poor don't fly in federal court..

Offline aygart

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Re: Take Back Lakewood
« Reply #2240 on: June 27, 2017, 10:49:57 PM »
The federal poverty limits don't change due to private school tuition costs.

There are no two sets of rules, and apparently, these sevoros and pilpulim to rationalize why people are really poor don't fly in federal court..
This is the part of the trap I mentioned in the penalize large families thread. It wasn't a favor to these families who now saw their parents arrested.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline avromie7

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Re: Take Back Lakewood
« Reply #2241 on: June 27, 2017, 11:01:53 PM »
The federal poverty limits don't change due to private school tuition costs.

There are no two sets of rules, and apparently, these sevoros and pilpulim to rationalize why people are really poor don't fly in federal court..
Of course the federal poverty line doesn't change based on private school tuition but considering the fact that a frum family can make exactly at the federal poverty line and have no money left after tuition and Yom Tov (and that's Lakewood tuition), many who are "cheating" the system, are still within the spirit of the law and that argument would definitely hold water in federal court and presumably lead to a very minor sentence. On the other hand those who are making $1m+ annually will have a much harder time getting away with it in court.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Offline MidwestJoe

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Re: Take Back Lakewood
« Reply #2242 on: June 28, 2017, 05:24:42 PM »
Of course the federal poverty line doesn't change based on private school tuition but considering the fact that a frum family can make exactly at the federal poverty line and have no money left after tuition and Yom Tov (and that's Lakewood tuition), many who are "cheating" the system, are still within the spirit of the law and that argument would definitely hold water in federal court and presumably lead to a very minor sentence. On the other hand those who are making $1m+ annually will have a much harder time getting away with it in court.

I don't know where you are getting your "feelings" about judges from. If people went through sophisticated methods to hide their income, then the reason why they did it won't make a difference. It shows a awareness and willful disregard of the law. Might the judge be more pissed and more inclined to give a max penalty to someone who makes a huge amount of money and still cheated the system, very likely, but that doesn't mean he will take it easy on someone who has a lamdus on why they deserve the money, when they broke the law with premeditated willful intent.

Offline aygart

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Re: Take Back Lakewood
« Reply #2243 on: June 28, 2017, 05:26:09 PM »
I don't know where you are getting your "feelings" about judges from. If people went through sophisticated methods to hide their income, then the reason why they did it won't make a difference. It shows a awareness and willful disregard of the law. Might the judge be more pissed and more inclined to give a max penalty to someone who makes a huge amount of money and still cheated the system, very likely, but that doesn't mean he will take it easy on someone who has a lamdus on why they deserve the money, when they broke the law with premeditated willful intent.
How about a Jury of people on programs.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline HBS

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Re: Take Back Lakewood
« Reply #2244 on: June 28, 2017, 06:10:57 PM »
How about a Jury of people on programs.
More likely going to be a Jury of people who dislike Yidden at the very least. They will have 0 sympathy for the fact that they are on programs

Offline takebacklakewood

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Re: Take Back Lakewood
« Reply #2245 on: June 28, 2017, 10:38:17 PM »
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Offline yelped

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Re: Take Back Lakewood
« Reply #2246 on: June 28, 2017, 10:41:12 PM »

Offline MidwestJoe

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Re: Take Back Lakewood
« Reply #2247 on: June 28, 2017, 10:42:08 PM »
I just read the statement from the Vaad lecturing about the importance of morality and integrity. It left me with a very bad taste that will need a combination of Listerine and Chlorine Bleach to wash out of my mouth. You want to know where the problem starts, Hakol Holeich Achar HaRosh.  If everything is good as long as it is for the "Yeshiva" (even when it's not), then how much of a stretch is it to say that everything is OK as long as it is done so you can pay tuition for your kids in Yeshiva.

Another 390 of these cases, and it may start getting close to the value of the Cedarbridge land.

Offline aygart

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Re: Take Back Lakewood
« Reply #2248 on: June 28, 2017, 11:39:10 PM »
I just read the statement from the Vaad lecturing about the importance of morality and integrity. It left me with a very bad taste that will need a combination of Listerine and Chlorine Bleach to wash out of my mouth. You want to know where the problem starts, Hakol Holeich Achar HaRosh.  If everything is good as long as it is for the "Yeshiva" (even when it's not), then how much of a stretch is it to say that everything is OK as long as it is done so you can pay tuition for your kids in Yeshiva.

Another 390 of these cases, and it may start getting close to the value of the Cedarbridge land.
This is not a small thing. Even if it is only an impression given it had the same effect.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline Toasted

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Re: Take Back Lakewood
« Reply #2249 on: June 28, 2017, 11:52:12 PM »
I just read the statement from the Vaad lecturing........
I wouldn't be surprised if this statement was part of either a concerted or unconcerted effort to prove to the higher ups that we'd like to solve this as a community and have them slow the fury.