Author Topic: Keeping Up With The Kushners  (Read 114365 times)

Offline chinagel

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Re: Keeping Up With The Kushners
« Reply #220 on: January 23, 2017, 06:18:04 PM »
Close.  If the rabbi who allegedly gave them an unwarranted exemption in fact did so, and he is the same rabbi who converted her, there is room to claim that the rabbi who converted her is not qualified to administrate conversions.  The article I linked earlier seems to convincingly put such claims to rest.
that article didnt prove anything imo.

Offline Boruch999

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Re: Keeping Up With The Kushners
« Reply #221 on: January 23, 2017, 06:19:32 PM »
that article didnt prove anything imo.

convincing ~= proof

Offline chinagel

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Re: Keeping Up With The Kushners
« Reply #222 on: January 23, 2017, 06:20:40 PM »
convincing ~= proof
he basically said he thinks she was mekabel

Offline Cheesecake

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Re: Keeping Up With The Kushners
« Reply #223 on: January 23, 2017, 06:42:25 PM »
So lets assume it was legit. If now she violated all 613 commandments she would still be a Jew, correct?
Yes

Offline Cheesecake

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Re: Keeping Up With The Kushners
« Reply #224 on: January 23, 2017, 06:46:45 PM »
The only thing that matters is what she believed at time of conversion, correct? If she changes after that I thought you said that has no effect on the legitimacy of the conversion.
The question is, do subsequent violations indicate that the acceptance was insincere, or is it just a human failing, which we all do to some extent.

Offline chff

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Re: Keeping Up With The Kushners
« Reply #225 on: January 23, 2017, 07:07:00 PM »
While everyone is busy with Ivanka, Jared was by the parade/ball/church together with her, and no question on him as he a Jew from birth, and openly declared that he is an observant jew

Offline Amusch

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Re: Keeping Up With The Kushners
« Reply #226 on: January 23, 2017, 07:21:40 PM »
So lets assume it was legit. If now she violated all 613 commandments she would still be a Jew, correct?

The answer to this is probably. There was a famous case where Rav Soloveitchik from YU said that since someone showed post-conversion no true intention of maintaining his religion, he uprooted the conversion retroactively.
Her conversion seems slightly iffy, but when push comes to shove, since she has a decent idea of core Jewish mitzvos, and seemed to have accepted them full-heartedly, as she understood them, she probably really is Jewish. Knowledge of nuance, or the greater community's standards of observance would probably be ideal but not necessary for a conversion to be valid.

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: Keeping Up With The Kushners
« Reply #227 on: January 23, 2017, 07:28:13 PM »
While everyone is busy with Ivanka, Jared was by the parade/ball/church together with her, and no question on him as he a Jew from birth, and openly declared that he is an observant jew
And he went home with Ivanka!

See what I did there? ;)

Offline aygart

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Re: Keeping Up With The Kushners
« Reply #228 on: January 23, 2017, 08:42:02 PM »
And he went home with Ivanka!

See what I did there? ;)
I see exactly
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline Redbull3

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Offline Boruch999

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Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: Keeping Up With The Kushners
« Reply #231 on: January 23, 2017, 09:05:10 PM »
http://libibamizrach.blogspot.com/2017/01/the-miracle-that-is-ivanka-trump.html?m=1
Quote
Let us celebrate this gift that Hashem has given us in having such attractive and prominent models of serious Jews in our time. 

Nebach

Offline chinagel

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Re: Keeping Up With The Kushners
« Reply #232 on: January 23, 2017, 11:47:26 PM »

Offline yzj

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Re: Keeping Up With The Kushners
« Reply #233 on: January 24, 2017, 12:04:05 AM »
I don't think we would be having this discussion if there was an appropriate description that we would use rather than lumping everything together as orthodox. We have "chassidish, ultra orthodox, etc. why not have a term " Culturally Orthodox Jews" or the like which would be an accurate description of those who have an affinity and identify with orthodox Jewishness on a cultural level while not yet being 100% on board in practice. I think this would eliminate a lot of the confusion and murkiness. And, let me say, I am really proud and excited that we have a wonderful Culturally Orthodox Jewish couple in Washington!

Offline aygart

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Re: Keeping Up With The Kushners
« Reply #234 on: January 24, 2017, 12:12:08 AM »
I don't think we would be having this discussion if there was an appropriate description that we would use rather than lumping everything together as orthodox. We have "chassidish, ultra orthodox, etc. why not have a term " Culturally Orthodox Jews" or the like which would be an accurate description of those who have an affinity and identify with orthodox Jewishness on a cultural level while not yet being 100% on board in practice. I think this would eliminate a lot of the confusion and murkiness. And, let me say, I am really proud and excited that we have a wonderful Culturally Orthodox Jewish couple in Washington!
Can someone convert to that?
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Offline JTZ

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Re: Keeping Up With The Kushners
« Reply #235 on: January 24, 2017, 12:19:33 AM »
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline aygart

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Re: Keeping Up With The Kushners
« Reply #236 on: January 24, 2017, 12:22:26 AM »
+1  :)
If you are looking, I am sure there are Rabbi's who will do it.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline yzj

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Re: Keeping Up With The Kushners
« Reply #237 on: January 24, 2017, 12:24:22 AM »
Can someone convert to that?
I would think that wouldn't be relevant since in the end of the day they are really self identifying as (Culturally) Orthodox. There would certainly be implications downstream vis a vis marriage etc. but that would be an issue that could be discussed down the road...

Offline JTZ

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Re: Keeping Up With The Kushners
« Reply #238 on: January 24, 2017, 12:25:34 AM »
If you are looking, I am sure there are Rabbi's who will do it.
If I wanted to go that route I actually know a reform Rabbi.  :)
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline aygart

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Re: Keeping Up With The Kushners
« Reply #239 on: January 24, 2017, 12:26:28 AM »
but that would be an issue that could be discussed when they become a public figure.
FTFY
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