Author Topic: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!  (Read 66087 times)

Offline as2

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #330 on: April 20, 2017, 02:39:08 PM »
Frum people never do real reviews because they're afraid it's lashon hara. That's why stories like this happen
I'm sure he'll accept first person accounts from non jewish/frum employees in the kitchen as well
Memories last forever, make them while you can.

Offline grodnoking

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #331 on: April 20, 2017, 02:42:52 PM »
I registered the domain PesachPrograms.com and will create a website as soon as time permits.
Maybe try something more general, like Yom Tov program because there are other holidays which people go to hotels too
I'm not who you think I am.

Offline Dan

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #332 on: April 20, 2017, 02:43:18 PM »
Don't know about Kashrus agencies, but IMHO any program labeled as "luxury", probably wouldn't have Kashrus standards as their top priority (I am not saying they don't care about Kashrus, but I would guess that it's not top priority, but rather the "luxury" aspect is the top priority).
That's nonsense.
Trustworthy programs like KMR and POTM where I was this year advertise luxury and have strong kashrus standards.

POTM is run by a shliach at a Four Seasons and all of the Rabonim and mashgichim ate the program's regular food as well.

What boggles my mind is why anyone would have signed up to attend a Prime program or any program that is run by a sheister...
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Offline theduke

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #333 on: April 20, 2017, 02:43:39 PM »
If not for the food, what draws them there? Do they get paid any significant $$ besides for their stay being covered?
I would assume they get paid, why else would you do it?

Offline Dan

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #334 on: April 20, 2017, 02:44:53 PM »
If not for the food, what draws them there? Do they get paid any significant $$ besides for their stay being covered?
Top-tier speakers do.
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Offline Dan

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #335 on: April 20, 2017, 02:45:37 PM »
I would assume they get paid, why else would you do it?
A free all-inclusive suite for 10 days was good enough for me.
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Offline theduke

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #336 on: April 20, 2017, 02:47:25 PM »
A free all-inclusive suite for 10 days was good enough for me.
All inclusive means the food, but if you are not gonna eat the food then I sure hope you get paid. But in your case seems like you got compensated pretty nicely for a speech, pretty good gig if you can get one :)

Offline TimT

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #337 on: April 20, 2017, 02:48:40 PM »
Frum people never do real reviews because they're afraid it's lashon hara.
Not anymore. Just read through some of the restaurant & destination threads.

Offline Menachem613

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #338 on: April 20, 2017, 02:52:15 PM »
I was there.

The program was complete chaos and disorganization. I was there last year as well and while the food was awful, there was plenty of it and we had a nice time since the property is gorgeous and we enjoyed the crowd. This year was just ridiculous. Not enough food, no tea room, nobody to talk to about the multiple issues.

Regarding the article above, the story was that the hotel gave the program a bill of about $250k at the end of the program for services they claimed they provided (on top of what the program had already paid them) which the program claimed was inaccurate. The program owner slipped out of the hotel at 4AM after chag.

We checked out early since our flight was early afternoon and all was fine. About 1pm the hotel realized that the owner of the program had skipped town and so they started detaining guests and refusing to allow them to leave the property without paying extravagant amounts, from $5k-$35k per family...

The property is about a mile or more off the main road. There is a long road (about 5-10 minutes) once you get off the highway to the property. There are 3 security checkpoints along that road and they do not let you off the property without a pass from the hotel showing you are paid up in full.

As far as I know everyone left, paid with their Amex cards and are planning to dispute these charges.

Omg

Offline ExGingi

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #339 on: April 20, 2017, 03:09:56 PM »
That's nonsense.
Trustworthy programs like KMR and POTM where I was this year advertise luxury and have strong kashrus standards.
I never said they don't have strong Kashrus standards.

However, even with strong Kashrus standards, FWIU there are always compromises that not everyone would gladly accept if they were fully aware (talk to mashgichim). Especially when it comes to Pesach, while some things might just be "chumros", for someone who follows the Rebbe's directives, there seems to be very strict guidance regarding gebrokts. It is close to impossible to maintain that standard in a hotel where not everyone is aware and cares about it.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
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Offline Dan

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #340 on: April 20, 2017, 03:12:20 PM »
for someone who follows the Rebbe's directives, there seems to be very strict guidance regarding gebrokts.
Once again you're full of assumptions. The mashgichim at POTM for example were all Chabad.
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Offline cmey

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #341 on: April 20, 2017, 03:20:37 PM »
Once again you're full of assumptions. The mashgichim at POTM for example were all Chabad.

I know an Amazing Chabad Rabbi. I would eat in his house in a heartbeat. I  was in touch with him about a wedding where he was in charge of the caterer and the compromises he had to make were to the extent that I was unable to eat by the wedding and I don't have very exacting standards so I think it has a lot more to do with the venue then the person doing the hashgacha although there are some mashgichim who won't take a venue that isn't lichatchila in every aspect. for various reasons this Rabbi did not have a choice in the matter. It's easy to see a situation where even a good chabad shliach will have to end up stretching things kashrus wise when they majorly conflict with the venues image/ needs etc. sometimes there are intractable issues come up that you can't just walk away from once you've comitted.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2017, 03:28:53 PM by cmey »

Offline Emkay

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #342 on: April 20, 2017, 03:22:52 PM »
I registered the domain PesachPrograms.com and will create a website as soon as time permits.
For someone who seems to have coined the term "Chumra" I'm surprised you are so quick to do this without thinking about lashon hara.

Offline runnergirl

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #343 on: April 20, 2017, 03:23:15 PM »
Once again you're full of assumptions. The mashgichim at POTM for example were all Chabad.

In our case we just trusted. They were running 2 programs this year and did so last year as well. Most ppl are reputable. In this case they were unfortunately not. We went on KMR before and that was really top quality!

Offline avromie7

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #344 on: April 20, 2017, 03:26:12 PM »
I never said they don't have strong Kashrus standards.

However, even with strong Kashrus standards, FWIU there are always compromises that not everyone would gladly accept if they were fully aware (talk to mashgichim). Especially when it comes to Pesach, while some things might just be "chumros", for someone who follows the Rebbe's directives, there seems to be very strict guidance regarding gebrokts. It is close to impossible to maintain that standard in a hotel where not everyone is aware and cares about it.
As far as gebrokts, it's very simple, no matza or matza meal in the food. The only possible issue would be if you're worried that someone else is not makpid and you end up with the same plate or bowl that they used the day before for gebrokts.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.