Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!

[as2]

I hope you don't have any cleaning help. That would take away from your sense of satisfaction?

You clearly missed the boat.

[Menachem613]

You seem very defensive. I think both sides need to take an understanding of the other side.


 And no I'll argue here that if you never had to make Pesach than even someone explaining it to you won't really give you even close to the  full effect of what it really entails.

Of course I'm defensive- my choice is being attacked as lacking in so many areas.

Again, I've stayed home many, many times while those attacking my choice have only seen one side. I've seen both. 

[chevron]

when I learned nikkur I used to bring home the "treif" skirt steaks, hanger steaks, and 12th rib which that particular hashgacha didn't allow. I was menaker and moleiach them at home with my kids. When we did nikkur on a whole rosh keves , now that was quite am experience for her.

Chol hamoed in chavat maon, doing shechita and nikkur on a lamb MMMMMMMMMMMMMM

[Dan]

Stinks to have to fly on a plane to Israel.
Was so much more meaningful to spend a year to get there via horse. Nowadays you just swipe your cards and your kids will have no appreciation for the place.
Sad!

[hvaces42]

That being said, can you appreciate how someone else might be ok and even happy to not have to do the work and sit down to  meal prepared for them and still have a beautiful meaningful seder?

Nahama dchisufa

[aygart]

+1

It was nebech not facetious. Money pays for everything. Of course I'm jealous that i cant lay back and let someone else do the hard work. But I'm also grateful that I can and do contribute. Not only my wife works hard I do too. And when you sit down to the seder with a feeling of accomplishment, there is nothing like it. I cannot imagine what it would be like sitting down after having written that check or swiped that card and not having lifted a finger in preparation for yom tov. I would probably be sick to my stomach. Thats subjective. 

How about going to parents/in-laws/children for pesach?

[JTZ]

And the Goy gets the win!

It is not like I haven't seen this discussion before and I am not talking DDF.

[sky121]

Stinks to have to fly on a plane to Israel.
Was so much more meaningful to spend a year to get there via horse. Nowadays you just swipe your cards and your kids will have no appreciation for the place.
Sad!

+1


Again, this is great because it makes a point.



(On the other hand I Actually try to remember that people had to take a boat and it took forever whenever I'm flying Coach on a long flight. Makes me happy and more appreciative.

[JTZ]

How many years is sufficient to gain the required hands on experience?

It depends how much you want to learn about something. I am a true believer in the more times you do something the more you learn about it.

[as2]

Stinks to have to fly on a plane to Israel.
Was so much more meaningful to spend a year to get there via horse. Nowadays you just swipe your cards and your kids will have no appreciation for the place.
Sad!

There's a difference between assuming luxury is the norm and the times changing.

[sky121]

I always think about this when new technology comes out that people are against for Shabbos for example. That, at one point when we got electricity others before then felt the same way about those changes.

Everything has to be taken with an open mind.

[aygart]

Of course I'm defensive- my choice is being attacked as lacking in so many areas.

Again, I've stayed home many, many times while those attacking my choice have only seen one side. I've seen both. 

I agree-depending on the program. I have done both and would only go to a hotel if it was for whatever reason the only available option, but I can understand how for many there are reasons why that is the case.

[Dan]

There's a difference between assuming luxury is the norm and the times changing.

I don't think anyone is arguing that it isn't healthy to go to a program every year.

But it's nice to give everyone a break now and then if you can swing it and if your minhagim allow for it.

[chevron]

Stinks to have to fly on a plane to Israel.
Was so much more meaningful to spend a year to get there via horse. Nowadays you just swipe your cards and your kids will have no appreciation for the place.
Sad!

Maybe, but oleh regel was a huge yom tov back in the day. Imagine how crazy jerusalem was erev pesach ?

Do you read and internalize the text in the siddur after "korban pesach"

This year for the first time i'll bake matzos mitzvah, im excited

[hvaces42]

Stinks to have to fly on a plane to Israel.
Was so much more meaningful to spend a year to get there via horse. Nowadays you just swipe your cards and your kids will have no appreciation for the place.
Sad!

Please dont equate visiting Eretz Yisrael with preparing for a yom tov.

Also, you're too young to appreciate that when you saw a Jew from Eretz Yisrael he was held in reverance. I'm talking 1970's, 1980's it was a distant place that has now become more accessible.

[Dan]

Also, you're too young to appreciate that when you saw a Jew from Eretz Yisrael he was held in reverance. I'm talking 1970's, 1980's it was a distant place that has now become more accessible.

Exactly. Times change. Some old feeling won't be felt anymore as they did in the day it took a boat ride to cross the Atlantic. Those days aren't coming back.
We also have electricity by our Seders. Judaism and our kids will survive this too.

[sky121]

I think few would argue that there isn't something special and different about putting in all the effort and having Pesach in your own home, or at a family members home and the feeling that comes with it.

If you choose this as your only way that you want to do Pesach then great!

But to argue that the other way is "wrong" because it's different seems silly to me.
What about the feeling about being with so many yidden and many times different types of yidden and all celebrating Yom Tov together?
What about your kids seeing other families doing things a little differently, dressed a little differently, singing a little differently and all celebrating together?

Like all things there are plus and minuses to all.

[as2]

I don't think anyone is arguing that it isn't healthy to go to a program every year.

But it's nice to give everyone a break now and then if you can swing it and if your minhagim allow for it.

Agreed! I just didn't think his approach to those that were opposed to the idea, was right.

There was an idea to start a Ben Pakua farm once upon a time, and the main reason it was looked down upon, was because it would take many pieces out of our religion. A big part of our religion is built on customs and mesora.

[Dan]

Like all things there are plus and minuses to all.

+1K

[Dan]

While I myself am not a hotel person I don't think you "need to make your wife work" just to be able to show her appreciation.

+1K.