Author Topic: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!  (Read 52531 times)

Online whYME

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #525 on: April 21, 2017, 03:56:41 PM »
Non-Jewish workers would bring pizza and donuts into the kitchen (yes you read right) and no one cared at all.
At least here it was the non-jewish workers. I just heard about a case where the "mashgichim" were bringing in chometz. (I heard this secondhand, from my BIL who heard it directly from his friend who was one of these "mashgichim.")
In fact this "mashgiach" said that the people there were lucky if anything they ate was kosher at all, let alone KFP. The "mashgichim" were sitting around drinking whiskey and totally couldn't give a crap about anything that happened in the kitchen.

I'm not saying this is the norm but apparently it does happen...

Offline AsherO

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #526 on: April 21, 2017, 04:11:39 PM »
At least here it was the non-jewish workers. I just heard about a case where the "mashgichim" were bringing in chometz. (I heard this secondhand, from my BIL who heard it directly from his friend who was one of these "mashgichim.")
In fact this "mashgiach" said that the people there were lucky if anything they ate was kosher at all, let alone KFP. The "mashgichim" were sitting around drinking whiskey and totally couldn't give a crap about anything that happened in the kitchen.

I'm not saying this is the norm but apparently it does happen...

That just sounds crazy.
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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #527 on: April 21, 2017, 04:17:24 PM »
At least here it was the non-jewish workers. I just heard about a case where the "mashgichim" were bringing in chometz. (I heard this secondhand, from my BIL who heard it directly from his friend who was one of these "mashgichim.")
In fact this "mashgiach" said that the people there were lucky if anything they ate was kosher at all, let alone KFP. The "mashgichim" were sitting around drinking whiskey and totally couldn't give a crap about anything that happened in the kitchen.

I'm not saying this is the norm but apparently it does happen...
I would fire a mashgiach after one warning for drinking anything on the job. (Matuk Kal for sales koisos.)

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #528 on: April 21, 2017, 04:30:12 PM »

At least here it was the non-jewish workers. I just heard about a case where the "mashgichim" were bringing in chometz. (I heard this secondhand, from my BIL who heard it directly from his friend who was one of these "mashgichim.")
In fact this "mashgiach" said that the people there were lucky if anything they ate was kosher at all, let alone KFP. The "mashgichim" were sitting around drinking whiskey and totally couldn't give a crap about anything that happened in the kitchen.

I'm not saying this is the norm but apparently it does happen...
When I was a bochur, a good friend of mine who used to do Hashgocho gigs for the OK told me, that the OK will not take Lubavitchers as mashgichim for Sukkos programs. The reasoning was that a "Lubavitcher" who would go on such a program, couldn't be makpid on not drinking outside the sukkah, so if he's willing to go somewhere where he can't keep up to that, he might not be so ירא שמים. While for a non-Lubavitcher drinking outside the sukkah is a non-issue.

I don't know if this was a strict policy, and whether it might be the current policy, or only an idea that came up in conversation.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #529 on: April 21, 2017, 04:32:05 PM »
When I was a bochur, a good friend of mine who used to do Hashgocho gigs for the OK told me, that the OK will not take Lubavitchers as mashgichim for Sukkos programs. The reasoning was that a "Lubavitcher" who would go on such a program, couldn't be makpid on not drinking outside the sukkah, so if he's willing to go somewhere where he can't keep up to that, he might not be so ירא שמים. While for a non-Lubavitcher drinking outside the sukkah is a non-issue.

I don't know if this was a strict policy, and whether it might be the current policy, or only an idea that came up in conversation.

Sure,  but the bochurim who want to go to cancun for pesach are probably spending their spare time drawing the kav

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #530 on: April 21, 2017, 04:32:40 PM »

Sure,  but the bochurim who want to go to cancun for pesach are probably spending their spare time drawing the kav
ALOL
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #531 on: April 21, 2017, 05:29:00 PM »

Just going to put this out there:

I am now married with kids but back in the days when i was single i used to work as a mashgiach in hotels. I worked in one program which was not very fancy for a few years and that program was superb with no issues. Later i worked in a program which was definitely on the fancier side. This program didn't care at all about kashrus, all they cared about was how happy were the guests. Non-Jewish workers would bring pizza and donuts into the kitchen (yes you read right) and no one cared at all. When i mentioned it to the head mashgiach he was too scared of the caterer and the kitchen staff and it all continued. Kashrus was not at all a priority.

I emailed the owners of the program at the time, but i'm sure nothing was done about it and the program probably still runs the same way. So if you are in a hotel program be aware there is a good chance you had a good time while eating pure chometz.
So does this corroborate my "assumptions" that were attacked by Dan?

And as for Dan's claims for circular logic used, after rereading what I wrote I can see why he thought so, though its more of an issue of חסורי מחסרא והכי קתני - missing the point that the bochur that sought the fancier Pesach sedorim (to clarify for the "outsiders" on this forum, older Yeshiva bochurim in Lubavitch often go to help run, or actually run themselves, public sedorim in all corners of the world) was known by his father not to be the type that would inquire about kashrus standards.

I am not saying that he's any less holy than anyone else, just that the emphasis and the priority list has luxury high up, while questioning or inquiring about kashrus standards seems secondary to that.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline thaber

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #532 on: April 21, 2017, 07:55:44 PM »
Sure,  but the bochurim who want to go to cancun for pesach are probably spending their spare time drawing the kav
Henche, so good to have you around.

Offline zh cohen

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #533 on: April 23, 2017, 01:19:04 AM »
At least here it was the non-jewish workers. I just heard about a case where the "mashgichim" were bringing in chometz. (I heard this secondhand, from my BIL who heard it directly from his friend who was one of these "mashgichim.")
In fact this "mashgiach" said that the people there were lucky if anything they ate was kosher at all, let alone KFP. The "mashgichim" were sitting around drinking whiskey and totally couldn't give a crap about anything that happened in the kitchen.

I'm not saying this is the norm but apparently it does happen...

I know firsthand of a program that hired a "bochur" who is (לעת עתה) openly not frum.

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #534 on: April 23, 2017, 01:38:18 AM »
At least here it was the non-jewish workers. I just heard about a case where the "mashgichim" were bringing in chometz. (I heard this secondhand, from my BIL who heard it directly from his friend who was one of these "mashgichim.")
In fact this "mashgiach" said that the people there were lucky if anything they ate was kosher at all, let alone KFP. The "mashgichim" were sitting around drinking whiskey and totally couldn't give a crap about anything that happened in the kitchen.

I'm not saying this is the norm but apparently it does happen...
I know firsthand of a program that hired a "bochur" who is (לעת עתה) openly not frum.
In one of the weekly papers around Lakewood shuls someone brought a story that his grandfather was a mashgiach somewhere and wanted to get a different job. He told the Bluzhever Rebbe that he wanted to get a different job since he was worried about the responsibility. The Rebbe answered "Who should be mashgiach instead? Someone who is NOT nervous about the responsibility?"
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #535 on: April 23, 2017, 10:52:22 AM »
pretty sure the Werner family doesn't eat the food from thier Pesach program. They bring their own food

they do bring their own food
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Offline Chief Rabbi of New York

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #536 on: April 23, 2017, 10:56:34 AM »
Many people in CLE didn't eat at Peking because it was owned by a non-Jew.

Then it was sold to a frum Jew from a respected CLE family and everyone started eating there. 2 years later he was busted for serving treif.

did it taste good?
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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #537 on: April 23, 2017, 11:07:27 AM »
did it taste good?
Why should it? I am sure the purpose was not to make it taste better.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline beeweegee

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #538 on: April 23, 2017, 11:11:11 AM »
I know firsthand of a program that hired a "bochur" who is (לעת עתה) openly not frum.
Years ago, I worked for a caterer (not Pesach) who hired a Mashgiach who wasn't frum (he did wear a yarmulka which on the job). I can't tell you how many times the Hispanic manager corrected him on matters of Kashrus.

Most notably:
Manager to waiter - "Please start putting the bottles of wine on the tables."
Mashgiach to manager: "Oh no, don't tell her that. I need to do that."
Manager to Mashgiach - "That's okay, these bottles are mevushal!"

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Re: Pesach Program in Greece Cancelled Just Now!
« Reply #539 on: April 23, 2017, 01:57:34 PM »
Years ago, I worked for a caterer (not Pesach) who hired a Mashgiach who wasn't frum (he did wear a yarmulka which on the job). I can't tell you how many times the Hispanic manager corrected him on matters of Kashrus.

Most notably:
Manager to waiter - "Please start putting the bottles of wine on the tables."
Mashgiach to manager: "Oh no, don't tell her that. I need to do that."
Manager to Mashgiach - "That's okay, these bottles are mevushal!"
the hashgacha shouldnt have allowed non-mevushal wine period