airline customer service hearing on capitol hill

[theyankel]

the hearing was a joke... half of the committee just complaining about their own experiences. and half touting the airlines that serve their local airport... the guy from san diego expects 9 airlines to fly direct to washignton? is he smoking something? some of those congress people are in smaller markets and served by smaller aircraft and need to go through a hub. i get that and it makes sense. the lady from hartford made a good point about reliability but lets not forget, that many a time, its not the airlines fault.
also, when talking to congress, applaud the airlines that goes out of their way to help... and when they do something positive... like the airline requesting to allow religious people to deplane first so they can reach their destination on time for shabbat... and other instances... but a lot of people in this game should get together and complain about lack of award availability and devaluation... although lets not forget that the airlines are in the business of making money... thats the bottom line... and they will never say that outright because they cant...

[aygart]

Congressional hearings are a joke...

FTFY. Their purpose is rarely to accomplish anything rather to posture politically.

[theyankel]

FTFY. Their purpose is rarely to accomplish anything rather to posture politically.

agree 100%

[aygart]

[greathummer7]

although the actual "hearing" is over, i spoke with congessman shuster's office (chairman of transportation committee) and they strongly recommended that we contact the committee as they are currently reviewing options for new legislation on airlines. they are reviewing yesterdays hearing as well as other info that they receive about customer complaints against airline practices
if they get dozens of complaints about mileage devaluations and other unfair practices, they will probably do something
THIS IS OUR CHANCE!!! CONTACT THEM, AND YOUR CONGRESSMEN NOW!!!
a short clear email and phone call is all they need. please repost. Dan, perhaps you can write a list of unethical airline behavior, especially regarding mileage programs, and how its obvious the airlines are bullying us as consumers, and post it on main site. Thanks!

Committee on Transportation and Infrastructure
U.S. House of Representatives
2251 Rayburn House Office Building
Washington, DC 20515
Phone: (202) 225-9446
Transport@mail.house.gov

I DO NOT TRUST Shuster.

He led the passage of a bill in 2014 that would allow airlines to advertise airfare ex-tax & fees, which is like bait & switch. Fortunately that time, Senate ignored him and did not take the up bill, and nothing happened.

Shuster is now introducing the same bill again in Committee & getting a vote today...better hope that it doesn't pass committee or that Senate doesn't take it up again. This will allow airlines to advertise ridiculous prices that you will never find. and who knows what kind of games they will play with "fuel surcharges" or "mandatory fees" that are not part of the fare.

[yelped]

I DO NOT TRUST Shuster.

He led the passage of a bill in 2014 that would allow airlines to advertise airfare ex-tax & fees, which is like bait & switch. Fortunately that time, Senate ignored him and did not take the up bill, and nothing happened.

Shuster is now introducing the same bill again in Committee & getting a vote today...better hope that it doesn't pass committee or that Senate doesn't take it up again. This will allow airlines to advertise ridiculous prices that you will never find. and who knows what kind of games they will play with "fuel surcharges" or "mandatory fees" that are not part of the fare.

It is a ridiculous law. I have no idea how congressmen can even try to justify it. There's obviously a lot of lobbying going on here.

[greathummer7]

It is a ridiculous law. I have no idea how congressmen can even try to justify it. There's obviously a lot of lobbying going on here.

He is dating (or dated in 2015-2016, no recent reproting) a top lobbyist for the leading US airline trade association.

[joe_miami]

It is a ridiculous law. I have no idea how congressmen can even try to justify it. There's obviously a lot of lobbying going on here.

It's not at all a bait-and-switch. Almost nothing else is labeled/advertised with taxes included, from a $2 soda to an $80,000 car. The point is to make consumers more aware of the absurd amount of taxes and fees that get tacked on.

[greathummer7]

It's not at all a bait-and-switch. Almost nothing else is labeled/advertised with taxes included, from a $2 soda to an $80,000 car. The point is to make consumers more aware of the absurd amount of taxes and fees that get tacked on.

That's been a frequent comment.

Sales tax on soda is fixed by state. so i know exactly how much that is upfront.

Maybe buying car there's more differing level of taxes, but how often are you shopping for car vs airfare? 1 car per 3?5?10 years? vs shopping for airfare...some on the forum probably do that daily.

imagine searching for airfare to Europe where each country levy different tax...it would be a nightmare to have to click through checkout for each airline/routing just to compare the final cost.

[joe_miami]

All of that would put pressure on the highest-taxing countries and highest-fee airlines to bring their prices in line.

[greathummer7]

All of that would put pressure on the highest-taxing countries and fee-imposing airlines to bring their prices in line.

no. it would just be airlines laughing all the way to the bank to advertise that unrealistic $50 transatlantic fare and shift all the work to compare fare to the consumer.

a typical trip planning would take hours to click through each routing instead of just look at the high level number.

[joe_miami]

no. it would just be airlines laughing all the way to the bank to advertise that unrealistic $50 transatlantic fare and shift all the work to compare fare to the consumer.

a typical trip planning would take hours to click through each routing instead of just look at the high level number.

As with your car example, how often does the average traveler book a flight to Europe with a wide variety of possible carriers in play? You're arguing against this based on flights that represent a tiny fraction of all flight purchases.

[greathummer7]

As with your car example, how often does the average traveler book a flight to Europe with a wide variety of possible carriers in play? You're arguing against this based on flights that represent a tiny fraction of all flight purchases.

do people not make vacation choices based on cost? perhaps you don't care about the flight cost but the average traveler definitely do, and would prefer the convenience of shopping for airfare on aggregate vs guessing/hoping only to get sticker shocked at the end and have to start over.

As heartless (and full of conflict of interest) as Bill Shuster who introduced the bill is, I can't believe there are consumers defending this...he tried to pull a fast one in 2014, only to have senate defeat it. i sincerely hope that this bill doesn't see the light of day again for the sake of consumers.

[joe_miami]

do people not make vacation choices based on cost? ...

Do people not buy cars based on cost? The list of additional taxes, fees, surcharges, etc., etc., on the average car purchase is as long as my arm, and the average car costs more than 10 trips to Europe.

[yelped]

Do people not buy cars based on cost? The list of additional taxes, fees, surcharges, etc., etc., on the average car purchase is as long as my arm, and the average car costs more than 10 trips to Europe.

Wow. You're getting really convulted here.

[greathummer7]

Do people not buy cars based on cost? The list of additional taxes, fees, surcharges, etc., etc., on the average car purchase is as long as my arm, and the average car costs more than 10 trips to Europe.

I'll indulge in your example for argument sake, however invalid as it may be.

1. if you want to buy an airfare through the same time consuming search process as buying a car, then that makes 1 of us. I don't fancy spending days "visiting" OTAs or human travel agents just to buy 1 airfare.
2. if you look at any site giving advice on buying car, one of the top tips is usually only negotiate on out the door pricing (if you didn't know this, this tip for you is free)
3. again, don't know about you. but i've not had too many experiences buying cars, because an average person buy 1 car anywhere from 3 / 5 / 10 / or 15 years!. on the other hand, a leisure flier could be flying 2-5 times a year, up to the road warriors and warriorettes flying every other week. wouldn't you want a simple process?

on the matter of high/rising taxes, if that's the issue, let the airline fight with congress on lowering taxes, or compete on price & product. don't play games with consumers.

[joe_miami]

Wow. You're getting really convulted here.

*I'm* getting convoluted? The other guy brought up the car example.

[joe_miami]

I'll indulge in your example for argument sake, however invalid as it may be.

1. if you want to buy an airfare through the same time consuming search process as buying a car, then that makes 1 of us. I don't fancy spending days "visiting" OTAs or human travel agents just to buy 1 airfare.

Non sequitur. There would be no need to visit a "human travel agent" to buy a plane ticket if this change becomes law. At worst, you'd have to click through to a few different sites — which most savvy shoppers already do anyway to check on seat availability, etc.

2. if you look at any site giving advice on buying car, one of the top tips is usually only negotiate on out the door pricing (if you didn't know this, this tip for you is free)

And? The starting price is always the price without all of the taxes, fees, surcharges, etc.

3. again, don't know about you. but i've not had too many experiences buying cars, because an average person buy 1 car anywhere from 3 / 5 / 10 / or 15 years!. on the other hand, a leisure flier could be flying 2-5 times a year, up to the road warriors and warriorettes flying every other week. wouldn't you want a simple process?

Again, you're just saying the same thing over and over. The average American buys a car more often than he buys a trip to Europe, and the average car costs 10 to 20 times more. Basic facts.

For domestic travel, which is the vast majority of travel booked by Americans, all airlines are paying the same federal taxes and fees and only some airport fees change, so this would have negligible effect.

on the matter of high/rising taxes, if that's the issue, let the airline fight with congress on lowering taxes, or compete on price & product. don't play games with consumers.

Airlines already "compete on price and product." The goal is to shine more sunlight upon the long list of taxes and fees added to plane tickets.

[yelped]

Airlines already "compete on price and product." The goal is to shine more sunlight upon the long list of taxes and fees added to plane tickets.

Do you work for the airlines? Your thinking is so backward.

Why do you think "shining a light" is going to help? No one is going to reduce taxes.

[joe_miami]

Do you work for the airlines? Your thinking is so backward.

*My* thinking is backward? Are you screaming for bottom-line pricing for cars, which cost far more than plane tickets?

What do you think "shining a light" is going to help? No one is going to reduce taxes.

On which planet does transparency lead to *worse* pricing outcomes for consumers?