Business Class to/from TLV - product thread.

[ExGingi]

Apologies if thread about this exists somewhere. I searched and couldn't find, so I figured I would start a new one.

I've flown the following airlines on the North America to TLV route in J:

DL - Overall best experience (though would have loved to have a NYC-TLV flight that arrives in the AM). Reverse herringbone lie flat, with excellent bedding. Slept so well that I can't comment on KSML!
LO - fake Euro business to WAW, dreamliner to NA. Decent seat on long haul. Nice lounge for connection. Useless IFE and soft product.
US/AA - great experience on lie-flat (herringbone or reverse - can't recall - now defunct route).
LX - lie flat with MOST seats direct aisle access. One of the few airlines to fly widebody between Europe and TLV. Very uncomfortable seat! Bad soft product. Good KSML.
TK - Lie flat on NA-IST. Some IST-TLV flights are widebody, presumably with lie-flat, but most are fake Euro business. Good KSML ex-TLV and ex-IST. Ex-NYC KSML looks like an economy meal with a sticker slapped on it to say business. Decent soft product.
SU - (flew DL to SVO - excellent soft product, hard product was lie-flat on 767 - not the greatest). SVO-TLV was 777. Angle-flat. Mostly empty cabin, flew with adorable infant, so got great soft product. KSML was edible (though good Kashrus). SVO-TLV usually has great availability using FB. Problem is North America to SVO.
Haven't flown UA as I can never find saver availability.

On most recent trip I almost booked DL revenue for under $3k using hidden city. Held off on booking due to some uncertainty, by the time I was ready to book, hidden city route was over $8k, while direct NYC-TLV was over $4K - probably the biggest price jump / missed booking opportunity I've ever had. Ended up booking LX using Mileage Plus, but switched return to TK due to bad experience on LX.

[AsherO]

What happened on LX that was so bad you switched to TK?

[ExGingi]

What happened on LX that was so bad you switched to TK?

Extremely uncomfortable bed! Soft product leaves something to be desired. I was booked on return LX TLV-ZRH-JFK.

Would have switched ZRH-NYC to UA ZRH-EWR which had availability, but UA said that since TLV-ZRH wasn't showing availability in J, I would be booked in Y for that segment. Never mind that I was holding 2 J seats on that segment (which wouldn't need changing - but they said could only change entire remaining itinerary, and not just ZRH-NYC segment, took me very long on the phone, so I wasn't going to start the HUCA game).

[PlatinumGuy]

LX soft product improved dramatically.

ZRH is far superior to IST, and the LX seat is better IMO, especially if you have the TK 2-3-2

The main advantage of TK is the schedule - better flight times than LX (2355 ex JFK) and better to split up the flight 9h + 1.5 then 3.5 +7

[aygart]

Extremely uncomfortable bed! Soft product leaves something to be desired. I was booked on return LX TLV-ZRH-JFK.

Would have switched ZRH-NYC to UA ZRH-EWR which had availability, but UA said that since TLV-ZRH wasn't showing availability in J, I would be booked in Y for that segment. Never mind that I was holding 2 J seats on that segment (which wouldn't need changing - but they said could only change entire remaining itinerary, and not just ZRH-NYC segment, took me very long on the phone, so I wasn't going to start the HUCA game).

Was that on an A330 or B777? How long ago?

[Dan]

Was that on an A330 or B777? How long ago?

A330 doesn't start until October.

[aygart]

A330 doesn't start until October.

I know its the other direction but....


And

[Dan]

Sorry, skimmed.
Was referring to DL.

[elya]

A330 doesn't start until October.

Come again? Every flight between NYC and ZRH, as well most between TLV and ZRH are on the A330!

ETA:

Sorry, skimmed.
Was referring to DL.

[aygart]

Come again? Every flight between NYC and ZRH, as well most between TLV and ZRH are on the A330!

ETA:

But has flown the 777 as well
https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/flights/todayinthesky/2016/02/22/swiss-airlines-flagship-boeing-777-now-flying-new-york/80784734/

[hvaces42]

Extremely uncomfortable bed! Soft product leaves something to be desired. I was booked on return LX TLV-ZRH-JFK.

Would have switched ZRH-NYC to UA ZRH-EWR which had availability, but UA said that since TLV-ZRH wasn't showing availability in J, I would be booked in Y for that segment. Never mind that I was holding 2 J seats on that segment (which wouldn't need changing - but they said could only change entire remaining itinerary, and not just ZRH-NYC segment, took me very long on the phone, so I wasn't going to start the HUCA game).

I flew EWR-ZRH last year on the A330. Lie flat bed was exactly 2 inches short so either my head banged the top or my legs didnt fit in the tiny footwell. The bed itself wasnt to comfortable either.

[elya]

But has flown the 777 as well
https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/flights/todayinthesky/2016/02/22/swiss-airlines-flagship-boeing-777-now-flying-new-york/80784734/

Okay so they flew it once. 

[ExGingi]

LX soft product improved dramatically.

ZRH is far superior to IST, and the LX seat is better IMO, especially if you have the TK 2-3-2

The main advantage of TK is the schedule - better flight times than LX (2355 ex JFK) and better to split up the flight 9h + 1.5 then 3.5 +7

I fully agree. ZRH is better experience than IST by a very wide stretch.

It was my first time on LX and I was totally unimpressed with soft product. Since it was a last minute booking, didn't have KSML on first leg. One FA showed DW the water bottle saying that she recalls from a previous flight that it's kosher

Only competent FA was a male on my side, who actually got us extra KSML from economy, as well as some fruit.

Bed is indeed too short and narrow. I can only try picturing someone like whYME trying to fit into that bed. Kind of like fitting into a Cuban taxi, but for a longer ride.

[moe8555]

Nice, keep it coming!  Would be great to see for BA and RJ.  And more commentary about KSMLs.

[chinagel]

what does first class lhr-tlv on BA mean

[elya]

what does first class lhr-tlv on BA mean

Exactly that! They fly 4 cabin planes on that route once or twice a day.

[hvaces42]

Anyone know what the MAD-TLV flight is in J? I hear they have one plane with blocked middle and one with real J recliners.

[elya]

Anyone know what the MAD-TLV flight is in J? I hear they have one plane with blocked middle and one with real J recliners.

A319 has "real" business class. (Actual recliner seat similar to domestic F, as opposed to the A320 and most other European carriers which is only a blocked middle seat)
Im pretty sure most, if not all their flights between MAD and TLV are sing the A319.

[hvaces42]

A319 has "real" business class. (Actual recliner seat similar to domestic F, as opposed to the A320 and most other European carriers which is only a blocked middle seat)
Im pretty sure most, if not all their flights between MAD and TLV are sing the A319.

Thanks. Thats what the seat map showed but seatguru had something different. Booked for Chanukah. Have the last row in J and Bulkhead row in Y for my kids.

[elya]

Thanks. Thats what the seat map showed but seatguru had something different. Booked for Chanukah. Have the last row in J and Bulkhead row in Y for my kids.

If the aircraft type is A319 then it will be the "real" J.