Author Topic: Origins Of Chassidus (The Good the Bad and the Ugly) And Is there A bad Jew?  (Read 12714 times)

Offline chinagel

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Re: Re: Comments That Leave Me Speechless...
« Reply #45 on: June 02, 2017, 04:42:18 PM »
i hear. That's just comes to mind because they actually go that way.
still not much of a complaint on chasidim, unless you think the chasam sofer also did things not in line with the torah...

Offline ben89

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Re: Re: Comments That Leave Me Speechless...
« Reply #46 on: June 02, 2017, 04:48:20 PM »
Not saying this pertains to all but to a good chunk... not caring about zmanim of tefillah. I'm not referring to shkiya which is a different issue.

Offline koplonko

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Re: Re: Comments That Leave Me Speechless...
« Reply #47 on: June 02, 2017, 06:06:48 PM »
Not saying this pertains to all but to a good chunk... not caring about zmanim of tefillah. I'm not referring to shkiya which is a different issue.
Ma Kesher?!? I know a litvishe guy that learns daf-yomi and eats cholov akum and shaves his beard r"l, does that make gemara not a part of Torah?

Offline ben89

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Re: Re: Comments That Leave Me Speechless...
« Reply #48 on: June 02, 2017, 06:12:00 PM »
Ma Kesher?!? I know a litvishe guy that learns daf-yomi and eats cholov akum and shaves his beard r"l, does that make gemara not a part of Torah?
you mean chalav stam? Where is any of the above against halacha without a good basis to be based on?

Offline koplonko

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Re: Re: Comments That Leave Me Speechless...
« Reply #49 on: June 03, 2017, 11:01:54 PM »
you mean chalav stam? Where is any of the above against halacha without a good basis to be based on?
1. You are mixing up "wrong" actions with the study of Torah that these people do. Just because they act in a way that you (as opposed to גדולי ישראל אמתיים, צדיקי עליון ) feel is against halacha, does not mean that something they study is suddenly not part of Torah.
2. On regards to it being "wrong", see parentheses above. Much stronger basis than cholov akum and shaving. No real people in pre-war Europe did that, ch"v

Offline chinagel

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Re: Re: Comments That Leave Me Speechless...
« Reply #50 on: June 03, 2017, 11:04:58 PM »
On regards to it being "wrong", see parentheses above. Much stronger basis than cholov akum and shaving. No real people in pre-war Europe did that, ch"v
you gotta study history

Offline aygart

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Re: Re: Comments That Leave Me Speechless...
« Reply #51 on: June 03, 2017, 11:59:06 PM »
2. On regards to it being "wrong", see parentheses above. Much stronger basis than cholov akum and shaving. No real people in pre-war Europe did that, ch"v
Let's get this straight. You ae saying that ignoring zmanei tfila has a stronger basis than misparayim k'ein ta'ar? Can you elaborate?

As far as "real people" in pre-war Europe, you are either totally ignorant or we are back to no true scotsman.

you gotta study history
and halacha
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline bobby

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Re: Re: Comments That Leave Me Speechless...
« Reply #52 on: June 07, 2017, 01:00:51 PM »
2. On regards to it being "wrong", see parentheses above. Much stronger basis than cholov akum and shaving. No real people in pre-war Europe did that, ch"v

a) You're wrong. The Chofetz Chaim wrote an entire sefer decrying the fact that so many people were using razors to shave.

b) Even if you were right, there was no mirsas in Europe nor were there electric shavers. So it makes zero halachic sense to compare the two when the metzius is completely different.

Offline ExGingi

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Re: Re: Comments That Leave Me Speechless...
« Reply #53 on: June 07, 2017, 01:21:44 PM »
... Hey listen there's a whole biography on the gra which has a designated chapter for his fights against chassidus. Then again they might not sell it in their stores because they don't want anyone to know it ever happened
Could it be that he was misled?

see for example: http://old2.ih.chabad.info/images/notimage/66250_he_1.pdf

Also, don't forget that he didn't have the benefit of over 200 years of history, on which he could have based his judgment, he might have only been assuming outcomes.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2017, 03:31:53 PM by ExGingi »
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
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Online mmgfarb

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Re: Re: Comments That Leave Me Speechless...
« Reply #54 on: June 07, 2017, 01:32:13 PM »
Can we get back on topic here? Take this conversation to the halacha thread or something.
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Offline Yehuda57

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Online mmgfarb

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"JS [is] a fetid cesspool of unvarnished linguistic manure, with lots of useless drivel and post-padding." -Moishebatchy

Offline ExGingi

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I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
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Offline etech0

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Re: Re: Comments That Leave Me Speechless...
« Reply #59 on: June 07, 2017, 03:41:13 PM »
So is that what they mean when they say circular logic?
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