Tragic News Master Thread

[Galitzyaner]

One thing is for sure, those that are calling for the current laws to be tighter etc., are AFAIU being foolish.
The guy who perpetrated the shooting in the Aurora theater as well as the one in the current story, were both very smart, very intelligent guys who were A+ students, with nothing to be suspicious of in the slightest.  They're reporting that this Lanza was an Honors student, for heavens sake.  If there'd be anyone who would pass a background check, and be eligible to own a firearm it would be them.  There always were, and always will be bad people here in this word עד ביאת גוא״צ בב״א.

[Dan]

Actually he was denied earlier this week when he tried to buy a gun so he stole guns from his mother after he killed her.

[Galitzyaner]

Actually he was denied earlier this week when he tried to buy a gun so he stole guns from his mother after he killed her.

Interesting, where'd you read that?  I wonder why he was denied.

[zale]

Truly I'm not sure what the answer is though.  I think that a few more of these will cause Israeli style checkpoints at schools, malls, and theaters though just like we have at NFL and NBA games.

And make life impossible to live while you are at it. Should we start taking our pants off at every school and mall we visit?

[Dan]

Interesting, where'd you read that?  I wonder why he was denied.

Somewhere in this blog,
http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/12/14/shooting-reported-at-connecticut-elementary-school/?hpt=hp_t1

And make life impossible to live while you are at it. Should we start taking our pants off at every school and mall we visit?

Am I saying I'm for that? No.
Will it come to that? I think it's within the realm of possibility, though not in the short-term.  I think that would happen before guns would be outlawed.

Do Israelis find life impossible?

[zale]

One thing is for sure, those that are calling for the current laws to be tighter etc., are AFAIU being foolish.
The guy who perpetrated the shooting in the Aurora theater as well as the one in the current story, were both very smart, very intelligent guys who were A+ students, with nothing to be suspicious of in the slightest.  They're reporting that this Lanza was an Honors student, for heavens sake.  If there'd be anyone who would pass a background check, and be eligible to own a firearm it would be them.  There always were, and always will be bad people here in this word עד ביאת גוא״צ בב״א.

Guy from the Aurora theater had automatic weapons and loads of ammo which he was able to easily purchase on the internet. Tighter gun laws (specifically on automatic weapons) may have not prevented the massacre entirely, but it may have prevented it from being as bad as it was.

[zale]

Do Israelis find life impossible?

"Impossible" may have been the wrong word. "Extremely inconvenient" is the correct word.

I travel the NYC subway every day to and from work. If they put metal detectors in there, it would make my life extremely inconvenient, and would probably kill an extra hour of my day.

Isreali's have long accepted living inconveniently as the norm. They live with bomb shelters in their basements, missile and rocket sirens in their cities, bullet proof busses, and security checkpoints at every center. Whether or not they "feel" this on a daily basis is entirely irrelevant. It is not a normal way of living life.

[Dan]

Guy from the Aurora theater had automatic weapons and loads of ammo which he was able to easily purchase on the internet. Tighter gun laws (specifically on automatic weapons) may have not prevented the massacre entirely, but it may have prevented it from being as bad as it was.

12 people died in the Aurora massacre.  Had any of the civilians have been armed it may have been preventible, but had he only had the glock and a shotgun and not the semi-automatic rifle would it have really made a difference?

All those online orders should've triggered a SAR type report, but that's a separate issue.

I'm playing devil's advocate here, and I do believe many of these things should indeed be more restricted.  But thinking that our problems can be solved by regulation is just a pipe-dream.

[Dan]

"Impossible" may have been the wrong word. "Extremely inconvenient" is the correct word.

I travel the NYC subway every day to and from work. If they put metal detectors in there, it would make my life extremely inconvenient, and would probably kill an extra hour of my day.

Isreali's have long accepted living inconveniently as the norm. They live with bomb shelters in their basements, missile and rocket sirens in their cities, bullet proof busses, and security checkpoints at every center. Whether or not they "feel" this on a daily basis is entirely irrelevant. It is not a normal way of living life.

We're a very reactive nation.  The day a mass tragedy (G-d forbid) happens on the NYC subway is the day before metal detectors are installed and fares go up.

[Galitzyaner]

First Sandy, now Sandy Hook.  Oy, what a year!

[zale]

12 people died in the Aurora massacre.  Had any of the civilians have been armed it may have been preventible, but had he only had the glock and a shotgun and not the semi-automatic rifle would it have really made a difference?

It may have. Not having an automatic weapon may have made the scene less chaotic, and may have given a bystander the capability of taking him down. (I use the term "may" because there is no certainty here. The theater was going crazy, and it was dark. So there is really no telling.)

I'm playing devil's advocate here, and I do believe many of these things should indeed be more restricted.  But thinking that our problems can be solved by regulation is just a pipe-dream.

No, there always were and always will be crazy people. Regulations will NEVER stop that. But it may EASE it, even if just a little bit, and that is good enough. You will never stop someone like Timothy Mcveigh from making a military size bomb out of stuff he bought from a local hardware store, but you can maybe, just maybe, stop gun-wielding maniacs from killing as many people as they do.

[Galitzyaner]

We're a very reactive nation.  The day a mass tragedy (G-d forbid) happens on the NYC subway is the day before metal detectors are installed and fares go up.

Totally, everything's reactive.  One day a guy put a bomb in his shoes, everybody's gotta remove their shoes.  Another guy put in his underwear, now everyone has to do pat-down (or the electronic equivalent).  Ridiculous.

Somewhere in this blog,
http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/12/14/shooting-reported-at-connecticut-elementary-school/?hpt=hp_t1

Just checked, I couldn't find any such thing.  He did use his mom's guns, as widely reported, but I haven't found anywhere reporting that he was denied a gun license, or that he even applied..

[Dan]

"Investigators say they believe Adam Lanza tried to buy a gun at Dick's Sporting Goods in Danbury on Tuesday, but was unsuccessful, a law enforcement source with knowledge of the investigation told CNN's Susan Candiotti.

Employees at the store – some 12 miles from Sandy Hook Elementary – have been interviewed and have searched the store's surveillance cameras for evidence that Lanza had been there."

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/12/15/children-and-adults-gunned-down-in-connecticut-school-massacre/?hpt=hp_t1

[Galitzyaner]

"Investigators say they believe Adam Lanza tried to buy a gun at Dick's Sporting Goods in Danbury on Tuesday, but was unsuccessful, a law enforcement source with knowledge of the investigation told CNN's Susan Candiotti.

Employees at the store – some 12 miles from Sandy Hook Elementary – have been interviewed and have searched the store's surveillance cameras for evidence that Lanza had been there."

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/12/15/children-and-adults-gunned-down-in-connecticut-school-massacre/?hpt=hp_t1

That's very ambiguous, it doesn't discuss if he had a license or not -that's the ikker.

[Dan]

All I can say is that in Brooklyn, NY, a place with heavy gun control laws, I'm scared to walk by myself late at night and would never ever let my wife or young kids walk alone at night.

Whereas in Beachwood, OH, a place with extremely lax gun control, I'd have no hesitations.

Regulations and safety are hard to correlate.  When criminals want guns they get 'em.

Banning guns in schools just ensures that noone will be able to defend against a criminal who doesn't care about a ban.

[Dan]

That's very ambiguous, it doesn't discuss if he had a license or not -that's the ikker.

When did I say anything about a license?

Actually he was denied earlier this week when he tried to buy a gun so he stole guns from his mother after he killed her.

Interesting, where'd you read that?  I wonder why he was denied.

[Galitzyaner]

All I can say is that in Brooklyn, NY, a place with heavy gun control laws, I'm scared to walk by myself late at night and would never ever let my wife or young kids walk alone at night.

Whereas in Beachwood, OH, a place with extremely lax gun control, I'd have no hesitations.

Regulations and safety are hard to correlate.  When criminals want guns they get 'em.

Banning guns in schools just ensures that noone will be able to defend against a criminal who doesn't care about a ban.

My mind wants to agree, but its hard to chew. 
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Quote:
Newtown, Connecticut, is where families move to keep their children safe.
..........
Now it will be known as the site of the deadliest school shooting in American history.
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Interesting articles in the wake of the shooting pro, and anti gun control - Adam Lanza Wouldn't Have Been Stopped by Stricter Gun Control Laws.

When did I say anything about a license?

My bad, sorry.  But how would anyone be able to buy w/o a license, anyways..?

[Dan]

But how would anyone be able to buy w/o a license, anyways..?

Most states don't require a license.  A background check is good enough.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_the_United_States_%28by_state%29

[zale]

All I can say is that in Brooklyn, NY, a place with heavy gun control laws, I'm scared to walk by myself late at night and would never ever let my wife or young kids walk alone at night.

Whereas in Beachwood, OH, a place with extremely lax gun control, I'd have no hesitations.

Regulations and safety are hard to correlate.  When criminals want guns they get 'em.

Banning guns in schools just ensures that noone will be able to defend against a criminal who doesn't care about a ban.

Come on, populated cities have always been plagued with crime. What makes you afraid to walk at night in Brooklyn, NY is related to certain faction of people within certain ethnicities that dwell in said area, that have a tendency to commit criminal acts. It's them you are afraid of, and you know it.

Odds are, if you were to get attacked, it would not be with a gun. It would likely be for something like your cellphone. You would probably walk away with a large mark on your face.

Here is the thing, if you were actually carrying a gun, and you used it against said perp, you would likely end up in prison for a few years, and start a riot in the process. (See: Trayvon Martin, Bernard Goetz)

There are many of the above ethnicity that are very good people, and do a lot of good for the world. But unfortunately, in the particular area we are talking about, 99% of crime is from said ethnicity.

[Galitzyaner]

Most states don't require a license.  A background check is good enough.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_the_United_States_%28by_state%29

Would be interesting to know why he was denied..