Author Topic: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.  (Read 26686 times)

Offline MES

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #60 on: July 27, 2011, 01:28:47 PM »
Either way the takeaway here would seem to be that there is no issur of profiting from a goy's mistake but you're gonna lose it all in the end anyway. And additionally, if you realize after the fact that you profited from a goy's mistake there's no chiyuv to return it, but if you do you'll see brocha in the end.

I disagree with your "takeaway". It is clearly a machlokes rishonim with different achronim saying different things. Hence the necessity to ask your Rav. In addition, even the rishonim who are matir, never permitted the other issurim that can be involved, namely Chilul Hashem and Being Meshaker. (All the poskim that I have ever seen permitting this were very clear that if there's a chance Chillul Hashem that is remains assur, with many of them then going on a rampage about how chamur the issur of chilul Hashem is)

If you want to be more informed on the topic, pick up a copy of "Halachos of other people's money" by Rabbi Bodner, where he goes through all of these issues very clearly. (though mostly in the footnotes, so if you can't read Hebrew you'll always come out stringent)

As Daniel said, I never said anything was assur or mutar, (though I might if you asked me), just bringing up the need to ask.

(I personally have already asked many shaylos from things that came up on this site and was told that some are mutar some are assur and sometimes I was told mutar but don't do it. I.e. a yid shouldn't do that even if technically it's permitted which I guess you could call lifnim mishuras hadin)

Offline skyguy918

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #61 on: July 27, 2011, 02:54:38 PM »
Whoa, slow down. I guess my laziness in not quoting posts is rearing its ugly head again. I was referring to the bottom line of the quote from the Be'er Hagolah that preceded my comments. Nothing more.

Offline dans fan

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #62 on: July 27, 2011, 04:11:12 PM »
excuse my harshness but you are all missing the boat first of all its taos akum not mateh second of all its got nothing to do with it if you understand how to look at the transaction halachicly its not genaiva 

Offline Daniel

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #63 on: July 27, 2011, 04:13:25 PM »
What about geneivas daas? Particulars should be discussed with a Rav. As AsherO said earlier, this is not the forum to have a detailed halachic discussion. Bottom line is that everyone should ask their LOR before proceeding here.

Offline dans fan

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #64 on: July 27, 2011, 04:20:44 PM »
What about geneivas daas?
i dont know what you are talking about

Offline Daniel

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #65 on: July 27, 2011, 04:25:51 PM »
You are leading them on to believe you paid X dollars just for one suit and really you got more.....this *may* be geneivas daas

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #66 on: July 27, 2011, 04:31:52 PM »
i guess its imp for ppl like you to always ask your lor. nothing personal if you are at question you should ask your lor
« Last Edit: July 27, 2011, 04:37:37 PM by dans fan »

Offline Dan

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #67 on: July 27, 2011, 05:27:20 PM »
You are leading them on to believe you paid X dollars just for one suit and really you got more.....this *may* be geneivas daas
If your receipt shows 1 suit for $157 and another for $77 that's the store's problem to figure out what their policy is.  The facts are all very clear on the receipt, the manager of the store will have a policy for their store and decide what to do. 

Maybe I should've also asked a Rov if I was allowed to get an item price-matched and then use a discount on top of that?  Or I can rely that a store manager probably will know that answer (and care more!  LORs have a life too rather than being bothered with questions of store policy and not of halacha.) better than your local LOR.

Now if you tell me that the higher item was on 1 receipt and the cheaper item was on a different receipt-there I can see something worth asking about.

/.02
« Last Edit: July 27, 2011, 05:30:51 PM by Dan »
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Daniel

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #68 on: July 27, 2011, 05:36:02 PM »
Now if you tell me that the higher item was on 1 receipt and the cheaper item was on a different receipt-there I can see something worth asking about.

+100
I am really only concerned about the two receipt scenario and the scenario where you get stuff for free after returns.

Offline WAM

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #69 on: July 28, 2011, 04:09:11 AM »
With the amount of back and forth of halachic debate on this thread; some people saying that it is wrong hashkafically, but not assur,  (which IMO, makes no sense,) others saying it's perfectly fine, and others saying it's straight up assur, why does it hurt so much to ask your LOR? If you're so certain that it's muttar, what do you have to lose by asking? And if you don't have a rabbi, remember: עשה לך רב. but if you don't want to have a Rabbi, because it's going to make you change for the good, then don't bother justifying your actions from a religious perspective.

http://www.torah.org/learning/pirkei-avos/chapter1-16.html#
This is a long article, but explains the importance of having a rav.

Keep in mind, that it's important to have a rabbi that will encourage you to grow at a rate appropriate to your current level.

Offline Lamdan

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #70 on: July 28, 2011, 09:36:02 AM »
Either way the takeaway here would seem to be that there is no issur of profiting from a goy's mistake but you're gonna lose it all in the end anyway. And additionally, if you realize after the fact that you profited from a goy's mistake there's no chiyuv to return it, but if you do you'll see brocha in the end.
Where did you get that takeaway from?!? The Be'er Hagolah wasn't discussing if it's asur or mutar - that's a major machlokes, he was discussing what his life experience showed, that it doesn't pay to be mat'eh akum, and Hashem repays one who returns ta'us akum.
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Offline Dan

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #71 on: July 28, 2011, 11:03:14 AM »
I'm sorry but when you've got 2 suits on one receipt it's not even a case of taus akum.  They're going to follow their store policy on how to process the return of one suit.  This isn't a case of even getting extra change back from a store.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Daniel

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #72 on: July 28, 2011, 11:09:15 AM »
Many times I get back 2 seperate receipts .

Offline Lamdan

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #73 on: July 28, 2011, 12:01:08 PM »
I'm sorry but when you've got 2 suits on one receipt it's not even a case of taus akum.  They're going to follow their store policy on how to process the return of one suit.  This isn't a case of even getting extra change back from a store.
I wasn't referring to this specific case, I was just sharing an interesting anecdote on the subject :)
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Offline dans fan

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #74 on: July 28, 2011, 07:35:22 PM »
Many times I get back 2 seperate receipts .
when i get 5 min of time i will answer your q

Online AsherO

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #75 on: July 28, 2011, 07:37:53 PM »
Many times I get back 2 seperate receipts .

When I had that situation, I bought both the the cashier and had them prorate it.
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Offline Nitantnel

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #76 on: August 01, 2011, 10:09:30 AM »

I had that happen to me with 2 platinum suits, normally $2,195 each, on sale for $1,400 for one and $77 for the 2nd and I bought them in 2 sizes not knowing which one would fit me...

Hay Dan, can you tell me about the platinum suites, are they worth all that money, do they go on any worthwhile sales? Iv'e been looking for a good suite for sometime now...

Offline Dan

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #77 on: August 01, 2011, 10:49:47 AM »
Hay Dan, can you tell me about the platinum suites, are they worth all that money, do they go on any worthwhile sales? Iv'e been looking for a good suite for sometime now...
Depends SPG Platinum may get you a suite, but with Hyatt you really need to be Diamond to get a suite.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Nitantnel

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #78 on: August 01, 2011, 11:04:25 AM »
Depends SPG Platinum may get you a suite, but with Hyatt you really need to be Diamond to get a suite.

Wow, this flew straight over my head.  :o :o :o care to elaborate?

Offline Daniel

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Re: Jos. A Banks, Buy 1, Get 5 Free.
« Reply #79 on: August 01, 2011, 11:29:33 AM »
Wow, this flew straight over my head.  :o :o :o care to elaborate?

I think it was a joke because you spelled suit as "suite"