Will your federal taxes be going up or down next year?

[thaber]

I don't disagree.

But consider this.  We adopt your rule, and we say that you only get a partnership allocation if you put money in, not sevices.

Now they make an investment.  They invest 100, and after 2 years its worth 200. So they could sell today, and the fund manager would get 20. But they think there's still untapped value so they hold on. 

Shouldn't you view that 20 as the managers skin in the game?

I hear that.

But they are rich! We shou.ld take more taxes from them so the middle class should get a refund!!!! We are cutting their taxes by taking money straight out of what should have been in their wallets! How will they be able to pay for their higher Obamacare premiums?!?!??!?

This is different. In fact, all special interest loopholes are different.
For example - If corn is not a profitable crop in the US, it shouldn't be planted. It's wrong to have tax cuts for corn farmers, create ethanol requirements (no ecological gain, according to all) etc. Which only exist due to lobbying and special political calculations. The country would be better off closing the loopholes and translating the savings into lower taxes or less debt across the board.
Same for oil and gas, railroads, and hedge funds.

[aygart]

I hear that. This is different. In fact, all special interest loopholes are different.
For example - If corn is not a profitable crop in the US, it shouldn't be planted. It's wrong to have tax cuts for corn farmers, create ethanol requirements (no ecological gain, according to all) etc. Which only exist due to lobbying and special political calculations. The country would be better off closing the loopholes and translating the savings into lower taxes or less debt across the board.
Same for oil and gas, railroads, and hedge funds.

Corn? You mean for popcorn?

I see you haven't been following my opinions through the thread.

[thaber]

Corn? You mean for popcorn?

I see you haven't been following my opinions through the thread.

I have, and understood you were being facetious. But I did read that as you not being anti loopholes.

[aygart]

I have, and understood you were being facetious. But I did read that as you not being anti loopholes.

I am anti loopholes as long as it goes along with a general simplification and flattening of the tax code. In general loopholes benefit those with higher incomes. With the current tax rates the loopholes should remain since that is the only way to even out taxes but ideally rates should be lowered and loopholes repealed.

[shwarmabob]

can you use 529 for private K-12 tuition as per new rules?

[avromie7]

can you use 529 for private K-12 tuition as per new rules?

Yes, but it seems that in order to take advantage of the state benefits, you need a state approved withdrawal.

[shapsam]

can you use 529 for private K-12 tuition as per new rules?

Yes.

[henche]

Yes, but it seems that in order to take advantage of the state benefits, you need a state approved withdrawal.

What are the rules for this?  And how does it work if the state deduction is when you put the money in

[shwarmabob]

Yes, but it seems that in order to take advantage of the state benefits, you need a state approved withdrawal.

ok. So how do I find out if it's NY state approved? Is it school specific?

[CPA]

ok. So how do I find out if it's NY state approved? Is it school specific?

Each state governs the rules of their 529 plan. The state you plan on contributing to needs to adopt the K-12 rule otherwise you will have issues when you withdraw the funds.

[avromie7]

What are the rules for this?  And how does it work if the state deduction is when you put the money in

I think you pay state taxes when you withdraw if it's not a state approved withdrawal

ok. So how do I find out if it's NY state approved? Is it school specific?

I think the state would need to allow withdrawal for k-12 which as of now they do not and I find it hard to believe they would any time soon

[henche]

I think you pay state taxes when you withdraw if it's not a state approved withdrawal I think the state would need to allow withdrawal for k-12 which as of now they do not and I find it hard to believe they would any time soon

What are the rules for state withdrawal?  Is it not linked to federal rules?

[Denverite]

What are the rules for state withdrawal?  Is it not linked to federal rules?

It’s even more than that. Some states (like Colorado) allow for you to deduct the FULL amount that you put in, so if I put in 20k and even if it doesn’t accrue any interest, I then take that 20k out to pay tuition it won’t help me on my federal taxes but will give me a 20k deduction off my Colorado taxes.

[Denverite]

Here is a link that shows the deductions for each state (you can put in more than these amounts but it won’t be deductible).

http://www.finaid.org/savings/state529deductions.phtml

[skyguy918]

What are the rules for state withdrawal?  Is it not linked to federal rules?

+1. I'm still skeptical that the states will have full power over how this change is put into practice. For example, I find it very hard to believe that any state would be able to tax the gains when a withdrawal is made for K-12. The deductions/credits I think could be in play, but I think each state would have to adjust the 529 provision in their tax code to explicitly exclude K-12.

I emailed NY's 529 plan, which apparently went straight to Vanguard:

I was wondering if you have any info on Congress passing the tax bill, including the provision allowing 529 funds to be used for K-12 tuition.

How would my NYS income taxes be affected by a withdrawal for K-12 tuition? Would gains still be tax-free? Would I keep my NYS income tax deduction?

Thank you for taking the time to contact us about New York's 529 College Savings Program-Direct Plan.

We have received your inquiry regarding the new tax plan.

We appreciate your patience while we research this matter. We expect to have more information as we work with the state to
see how the new tax plan affects your account in the near future.

[hachover]

For example - If corn is not a profitable crop in the US, it shouldn't be planted. It's wrong to have tax cuts for corn farmers, create ethanol requirements (no ecological gain, according to all) etc. Which only exist due to lobbying and special political calculations. The country would be better off closing the loopholes and translating the savings into lower taxes or less debt across the board.
Same for oil and gas, railroads, and hedge funds.

Theres much more to this than what you wrote. It isnt that corn is unprofitable, it is that US farmers can produce far more than the market demands. We used to (or still do) pay farmers not to grow their crops or to burn their crops so as not to crash the market price of corn (because that would create a shortage). Subsidizing ethonol is merely an offsboot of that

[ChaimMoskowitz]

Sanders, a U.S. senator from Vermont, prefaced his weekend tweets by posing a question Thursday.

“Doesn’t it tell us a lot about Republican priorities,” Sanders asked, “when the tax breaks for corporations are permanent, while the tax cuts for working families expire at the end of 8 years?”

[avromie7]

Sanders, a U.S. senator from Vermont, prefaced his weekend tweets by posing a question Thursday.

“Doesn’t it tell us a lot about Republican priorities,” Sanders asked, “when the tax breaks for corporations are permanent, while the tax cuts for working families expire at the end of 8 years?”

And you're back again with the same myth that's been debunked here multiple times.

[aygart]

And you're back again with the same myth that's been debunked here multiple times.

Only the gullibles are afraid of facts and will not acknowledge them.

[ChaimMoskowitz]

“when the tax breaks for corporations are permanent, while the tax cuts for working families expire at the end of 8 years?”

This is 100% fact. Would anyone like to put some money on it instead of just flapping your gums?