Author Topic: Rubashkin freed from prison.  (Read 81339 times)

Offline ChaimMoskowitz

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Re: Rubashkin freed from prison.
« Reply #840 on: February 04, 2018, 09:26:32 PM »
I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that missed these two posts and you weren't intentionally ignoring them link=topic=88429.msg1886044#msg1886044 date=1517788947]
a guilty plea by a new owner who bought the company after SMR was already in prison. that tells us something about what happened? or something about what the state wanted the company to say to be let live?
Heshy friedman has a foggy clue about what violations did or didn't happen before he got there?
Would never ignore you.  ;)
What about the human resources manager pleading guilty? Is this the same HRM under the old owner?
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Offline ChaimMoskowitz

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Re: Rubashkin freed from prison.
« Reply #841 on: February 04, 2018, 09:27:05 PM »
I repeat, if new owner (DJT) 'pleads' claims about what happened during his predecessor's (BHO) tenure, does the latter have any clue what actually took place befor he showed up? does his claim have any bearing on what actually happened? on 'facts'? or is it a simple legalese technicality?
What about the human resources manager pleading guilty? Is this the same HRM under the old owner?
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Re: Rubashkin freed from prison.
« Reply #842 on: February 04, 2018, 09:28:37 PM »
Would never ignore you.  ;)
What about the human resources manager pleading guilty? Is this the same HRM under the old owner?
I doubt it.
the prosecutor made sure to clean house. (any rubashkin holdovers would g-d forbid add value to the bankruptcy sale price and ruin the sentence).
note the 'no-rubashkins' clause in the bankruptcy proceedings

Offline ChaimMoskowitz

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Re: Rubashkin freed from prison.
« Reply #843 on: February 04, 2018, 09:31:35 PM »
I doubt it.
the prosecutor made sure to clean house. (any rubashkin holdovers would g-d forbid add value to the bankruptcy sale price and ruin the sentence).
note the 'no-rubashkins' clause in the bankruptcy proceedings
So there was child labor violations after he sold the company? The new owners new of this problem and did nothing? That is hard to believe.
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Re: Rubashkin freed from prison.
« Reply #844 on: February 04, 2018, 09:33:30 PM »
So there was child labor violations after he sold the company? The new owners new of this problem and did nothing? That is hard to believe.
in all likelihood the new owners plead to what purportedly happened before they arrived. (I'm guessing about the HRM, but the owner was certainly new...)
a plea like that has more bearing on the law than on reality...

Offline ChaimMoskowitz

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Re: Rubashkin freed from prison.
« Reply #845 on: February 04, 2018, 09:38:26 PM »
in all likelihood the new owners plead to what purportedly happened before they arrived. (I'm guessing about the HRM, but the owner was certainly new...)
a plea like that has more bearing on the law than on reality...
What about the human resources manager guilty plea? No way is any person going to plead guilty for something when they weren't even employed there at the time.
I am confused here. Are you saying there was no children working there?
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Re: Rubashkin freed from prison.
« Reply #846 on: February 04, 2018, 09:43:52 PM »
What about the human resources manager guilty plea? No way is any person going to plead guilty for something when they weren't even employed there at the time.
The owner certainly plead on things that he was not party to. I'm guessing the HRM was the same story.
Quote
I am confused here. Are you saying there was no children working there?
I wasn't there, I don't know if kids worked there.
I certainly don't know if the old management knew of their age. and the discussion of whether not hiring those who seem to be kids without proof of their youth will get you arrested for age discrimination I certainly don't know.
I just fail to see what a plea by an unrelated party, (which I presume to be a legal formality because I don't know what else to make of it), what it contributes to our knowledge of facts...

Offline ChaimMoskowitz

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Re: Rubashkin freed from prison.
« Reply #847 on: February 04, 2018, 09:49:18 PM »
I just fail to see what a plea by an unrelated party, (which I presume to be a legal formality because I don't know what else to make of it), what it contributes to our knowledge of facts...
If you think they are going to plead guilty to child labor when there was none I have a bridge to sell you. Especially the HRM!!!

Children testified at the trial. Did they all lie? Lets be real here. He was found not guilty of these charges but don't pretend children didn't work there. A simple google search will give you your answer if you care.
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Re: Rubashkin freed from prison.
« Reply #848 on: February 04, 2018, 10:02:02 PM »
Children testified at the trial. Did they all lie?
this part seems relevant, as they are alleging something they would have knowledge of. stick to it. leave out legal formalities that add nothing to the facts.

(you don't wanna do that, because that would leave you without the implied criminal knowledge of their age)

If you think they are going to plead guilty to child labor when there was none I have a bridge to sell you. Especially the HRM!!!
I'm sure nobody plead guilty to charges on their own behalf without committing the crime. my question here for the lawyers out there is, what is the legal value of a new owner (or HRM) pleading to charges on behalf of 'the company' or some other previous entity/person, with obviously no implications (or knowledge!) of the pleader?
I ask what it accomplishes legally, because I know what it means factually.

(If you're convinced that, although the pleading owner was clearly new, the HRM was a carryover, look it up. compare the names. shouldn't be too hard...)

Offline ChaimMoskowitz

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Re: Rubashkin freed from prison.
« Reply #849 on: February 04, 2018, 10:04:11 PM »
(the HRM was a carryover, look it up. compare the names. shouldn't be too hard...)
That's what I have been saying.
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Re: Rubashkin freed from prison.
« Reply #850 on: February 04, 2018, 10:04:46 PM »
That's what I have been saying.
fact? or assumption?

link? quote?

Offline ChaimMoskowitz

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Re: Rubashkin freed from prison.
« Reply #851 on: February 04, 2018, 10:06:19 PM »
fact? or assumption?

link? quote?
A common sense assumed fact.  :)
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Re: Rubashkin freed from prison.
« Reply #852 on: February 04, 2018, 10:09:47 PM »
A common sense assumed fact.  :)
you know what they say about assumptions.

regarding your 'common sense' logic, you're overlooking some basic facs, as I pointed out:
-some of these pleas were clearly newcomers. no reason the others shouldn't be the same story.
-leaving in a carryover HRM would go against everything else the prosecutors stood for. would be very surprising to say the least.

If you can verify your 'common sense' 'logical' ASSUMPTION, lmk.
otherwise PUOSU

Offline ChaimMoskowitz

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Re: Rubashkin freed from prison.
« Reply #853 on: February 04, 2018, 10:11:45 PM »
otherwise PUOSU
I think you should PUOSU, no? I already proved child labor unless you believe the kids lied under oath.
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Offline aygart

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Re: Rubashkin freed from prison.
« Reply #854 on: February 04, 2018, 10:27:03 PM »
I think you should PUOSU, no? I already proved child labor unless you believe the kids lied under oath.
You did not prove knowledge of that.
Feelings don't care about your facts