Poll

Are you frum and do you daven daily?

I'm frum and I (mostly) daven with a minyan 3x a day
92 (60.9%)
I'm frum and I (mostly) daven without a minyan 3x a day
18 (11.9%)
I'm frum and I (mostly) daven daily
22 (14.6%)
I'm frum and I (mostly) don't daven every day
13 (8.6%)
I'm not frum and I (mostly) daven daily
2 (1.3%)
I'm not frum and I (mostly) don't daven daily
4 (2.6%)

Total Members Voted: 151

Author Topic: Do you Daven?  (Read 18904 times)

Online Sport

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #225 on: January 11, 2018, 11:17:44 AM »
It was a rhetorical question but it was wrong for me to pray for such a thing.
No, it was not wrong for you to pray for such a thing, if only more people would pray for "trivial" things. besides the fact that if its important to you, G-D cares about it, It shows a recognition that everything, even the minute seemingly pointless things, come from G-D 

Offline chevron

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #226 on: January 11, 2018, 11:20:03 AM »
I consider myself an orthodox jewish man (30s). i wear tzitzis, go to minyan on shabbos/yom tov (with a sefer so i dont get bored if there isnt inspirational group prayer/singing), learn every day and care about learning/torah/mitzvos, keep shabbos and kashrus generally lechumra (though cholov stam/eat OU and rabbanut mehadrin).

I rarely make it to minyan during the week. i daven parts of shacharis every morning REALLY quickly (im talking 5 minutes, birchas hatora, Baruch sheamar, ashrei, yishtabach, shma shmona esrei, aleinu as tefillin come off). i used to daven mincha with a minyan at work when that was easy, but i'd have to switch elevators to go now so i dont and usually just dont say it :o. My issue is while i love Hashem and mitzvos etc, i dont really connect with the established prayer service, especially the start your engines ashkenaz silent speed read til the chazan says his line and then onto the next (and i just dont have time for more during the week with a family and a demanding job/people who need my attention). i have random heartfelt prayers at least once a week on average while listening/playing music/learning mussar/meditating. but when it comes to most classic davening, my only kavana is modim/sim shalom/occasionally magen avrohom (i know that's key but still). occasionally think of a sick friend/family member, or daven for someone's parnasah.  I have met several people like me, we are a bit to "rational" to get into this whole pray to god for every meal/god changes things just if u ask for it/god craves our prayers.

I wouldnt call myself orthoprax (u are welcome to), but something else. I care/love hashem very much, though obviously dont "fear" him too much bc i think of him like a really chill nice god. I dont think he sweats me skipping out on the rabbinically ordained prayer service/need for attending minyanim, esp if it means i will help my wife/kids/family/friends even a tiny bit more.

my kids are amazing and crazy holy. my son learns so much better than i ever did (im talking reading a whole perek with perfect translation in a hebrew chumash to me with real love and noting questions and answers of rashi with a big smile). i bring my son to shul every shabbos. unfortunately im definitely rubbing off on him (or hes just spoiled) and he obviously doesnt have the same fervor for davening that he has for learning. but i dont know what else i can do. 

My point is @wayfe, your husband is definitely not alone, and if he is a good husband and father and friend, and a grateful human being towards god and observer of his mitzvos, the fact that he doesnt tune into "avodah" doesnt make him bad, he may just be more of a torah or avodah jew.

Switch shull's. I really have this dilemma too... I meant to write this in another post but I davened for years in sephardic shull's (I was raised chabad but we davened in young israel, we used to do the bnei akiva minyan shabbat day.. later I davened at and read the torah at a sephardic traditional shull.. in israel when i moved, I davened at sephadic shull's)

I still chant a lot of the tefillah.. I miss living in Chevron, praying at the Mearah. America really is a spiritual wasteland if you need meaning.

In SF I pray often at Magen David.. I want to go to SF just to pray there!! Whole tefillah is song and singing, daveing is relaxed, doors and windows open, everyone so friendly.

Here... I dunno, I cant deal with the Chabad davening.. its just empty

Offline good sam

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #227 on: January 11, 2018, 11:23:38 AM »
A good thing that I got from reading this popcorn.
When I started davening today in the morning I thought to myself about struggles others have with davening.
I questioned myself am I davening the way I should? 

It made me daven with more kavonah and try to take it to a higher level.
Same!
If you don't care why would you comment?
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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #228 on: January 11, 2018, 11:26:53 AM »
Reading this thread we have ppl from different backgrounds with different upbringings, all are struggling in yiddishkayt.
We had recently a few popcorn threads discussing various chumaras and vetting process set up in our society, trying to deal with the fallout of this generation.

There are many really good pieces of advice laid out, but each needs to be considered in context. The chinuch/struggles of a BP kid is not that of CH and not of a MO kid.

But the underlying issue that is common across the board looks the same. Our chinuch, both from schools and from our parents , does not include enough Ahavas Hashem and א טעם אין ידישקייט. Combined that with the גשמיות תאוות נסיונות so prominent in this generation, without a strong connection to Hashem מה יעשה הבן ולא יחטא.


Offline good sam

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #229 on: January 11, 2018, 11:28:08 AM »
My advice? Get a Koren siddur, pray in english
There was a guy in my shul growing up who would daven in english, and loud.

"Holy Holy Holy is the Lord and his Legions THE WHOLE WORLD is filled with his glory."

Not a very stable dude. You may know him if you watched the Howard Stern show in the late 90s.
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Offline wayfe

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #230 on: January 11, 2018, 11:39:58 AM »
Thanks to all those who helped me gain new perspective and insight.
"I would rather have questions that can't be answered than answers which can't be questioned."
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Offline yzj

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #231 on: January 11, 2018, 11:40:35 AM »
Wow what a thread. As others have mentioned, the only way you will have any influence on your husband is through positive reinforcement, and genuine respect. Find some things you can genuinely respect him for in any area, not necessarily religious. His respect for you and consequently your influence on him will grow immensely.

With all due respect there may be another aspect here. The fact that you are almost able to contemplate the idea of being “true to yourselves” and living a secular lifestyle leaves me to wonder about the extent of your feelings and level of connection to God and religion in general and how they are expressed in your home. Is it something that has a place in everyday conversation in your life?

It is a mans mitzvah to davening, but genuine davening can’t take place in a vacuum. If there is no religious vitality in the home, and the extent of the connection to the frum lifestyle is superficial and largely revolves around the cost of the frum lifestyle etc. then the external expression of that is going to be apathy and disinterest in davening etc.

If there is room for you to grow personally in this area it will go farther than anything you could possibly say to your husband to influence him. Learning a few minutes a day from a book that speaks to you, attending a meaningful shiur/ lecture on a somewhat regular basis etc. and giving expression to your connection to spirituality in everyday life will reap dividends.

 In the meantime, if you have a husband who cares about you, is a devoted father, and is there together with you to deal with life’s challenges, you have much to be grateful for.....

Offline ChaimMoskowitz

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #232 on: January 11, 2018, 11:53:28 AM »
No, it was not wrong for you to pray for such a thing, if only more people would pray for "trivial" things. besides the fact that if its important to you, G-D cares about it, It shows a recognition that everything, even the minute seemingly pointless things, come from G-D
I fully understand why you say that. In my belief system it is not ok to pray to win a bet. If this was the political thread I could spin it as I was asking for help to quit.  ;)
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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #233 on: January 11, 2018, 11:56:10 AM »
asking for help to quit
nothing wrong with that
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Offline iAm

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #234 on: January 11, 2018, 12:03:13 PM »
I think the thing the OP struggled with, and @mgarfin mentioned, is that in an attempt by the institution to delineate what it takes to be a part of the community, we've created a very outward focus on what it means to be 'frum'.  As a whole, religion for many people has become more about what it takes to be included/excluded as opposed to what it takes to be an oveid hashem. And I dont mean that they're malicious or fakers or trying to deceive anyone. That is literally how some millennials perceive what being religious means in the 21st century.

Our chinuch system is also very built on 'protecting the moised', as opposed to actually building people with connection to God, and there seems little interest in structurally changing in from their part.
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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #235 on: January 11, 2018, 12:10:23 PM »
to the posters who daven 3x a day with a minyan--

Where do you live?
Where do you work?
How far of a commute?
what time do you get up?
just a thought about this, for a sec
As brought up earlier alot of the not going to minyan is excuses
i used to work out of town, closest minyan was 10 min drive and never made the effort as i assumed i was "patur" due to work obligations
Then when a colleague went i realized it was all just excuses and started going.....

We need a thread about davening on vacations
Poll
Do you only Vacation where you can daven with a minyan
Do you attempt to daven more than one tefila with a minyan
Do you daven at all on vacation

Offline skyguy918

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #236 on: January 11, 2018, 12:12:06 PM »
just a thought about this, for a sec
As brought up earlier alot of the not going to minyan is excuses
i used to work out of town, closest minyan was 10 min drive and never made the effort as i assumed i was "patur" due to work obligations
Then when a colleague went i realized it was all just excuses and started going.....

We need a thread about davening on vacations
Poll
Do you only Vacation where you can daven with a minyan
Do you attempt to daven more than one tefila with a minyan
Do you daven at all on vacation
You're skipping the more obvious indicator - what do you do on days you're not working.

Offline ChaimMoskowitz

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #237 on: January 11, 2018, 12:13:35 PM »
nothing wrong with that
Agree but that wasn't what I was doing.
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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #238 on: January 11, 2018, 12:14:16 PM »
You're skipping the more obvious indicator - what do you do on days you're not working.
and just sitting at home or day trips?
i would think people would be more inclined to daven  and with a minyan

Offline skyguy918

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #239 on: January 11, 2018, 12:16:59 PM »
and just sitting at home or day trips?
i would think people would be more inclined to daven  and with a minyan
That's what I'm saying. If you go to shul for shachris/mincha/maariv on Sunday, that's a pretty big indicator that the added difficulty of a work schedule (or at least the ready availability of that schedule as an excuse) is contributing to lack of minyan going the rest of the time.