Poll

Are you frum and do you daven daily?

I'm frum and I (mostly) daven with a minyan 3x a day
94 (60.6%)
I'm frum and I (mostly) daven without a minyan 3x a day
19 (12.3%)
I'm frum and I (mostly) daven daily
23 (14.8%)
I'm frum and I (mostly) don't daven every day
13 (8.4%)
I'm not frum and I (mostly) daven daily
2 (1.3%)
I'm not frum and I (mostly) don't daven daily
4 (2.6%)

Total Members Voted: 155

Author Topic: Do you Daven?  (Read 59796 times)

Online Dawie

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #260 on: January 11, 2018, 04:00:51 PM »
@yzj
, I sometimes feel like it would be easier to just end our commitment to Yiddishkeit and get used to a new lifestyle than to constantly have to grapple with contradictions. This was meant to be taken as a serious consideration of mine.

as if thats ever a solution

Offline wayfe

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #261 on: January 11, 2018, 04:01:48 PM »
Given the amount of times nagging is mentioned- I'm surprised everybody assumed that I must be nagging my husband to daven.

Actually, I am evolved enough (as are many of my sex) to understand that nagging is counterproductive. I don't think I ever nagged my husband to daven.

Actually the only method that works (at least for Shabbos tefillos) is my leaving the house after candlelighting and again Shabbos afternoon.
"I would rather have questions that can't be answered than answers which can't be questioned."
— Richard Feynman

Offline elit

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #262 on: January 11, 2018, 04:02:38 PM »
+1 it would help, though, if people actually know and appreciate what they are saying.
I think that's where thr biggest disconnect comes from.
seems to me the biggest disconnect is the purpose and goal of tefillah not the meaning of the words

Online aygart

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #263 on: January 11, 2018, 04:07:02 PM »
Given the amount of times nagging is mentioned- I'm surprised everybody assumed that I must be nagging my husband to daven.

Actually, I am evolved enough (as are many of my sex) to understand that nagging is counterproductive. I don't think I ever nagged my husband to daven.

Actually the only method that works (at least for Shabbos tefillos) is my leaving the house after candlelighting and again Shabbos afternoon.
I agree. THere is definitely a way to discuss it without nagging.
I think that some here are confusing being a nag over it that he would feel you are always watching and keeping tabs on his davening which would be unhealthy for your marriage and counterproductive with having a serious conversation about something which you consider to be a serious issue. I do not see an issue with having the conversation with him, but there would of course be issues if you ask him every da whether or not he davened.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline wayfe

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #264 on: January 11, 2018, 04:14:33 PM »
I agree. THere is definitely a way to discuss it without nagging.

We've discussed enough for him to know that it's very important to me...
"I would rather have questions that can't be answered than answers which can't be questioned."
— Richard Feynman

Online ExGingi

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #265 on: January 11, 2018, 04:18:26 PM »
We've discussed enough for him to know that it's very important to me...

And the good news is that from what I understand from you, he too isn't happy about his own situation.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline wayfe

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #266 on: January 11, 2018, 04:28:26 PM »
And the good news is that from what I understand from you, he too isn't happy about his own situation.

Well, this has been going on for 4 years already... So I'm not sure how good that news is...

But there's always hope!
"I would rather have questions that can't be answered than answers which can't be questioned."
— Richard Feynman

Online ExGingi

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #267 on: January 11, 2018, 04:44:19 PM »

Well, this has been going on for 4 years already... So I'm not sure how good that news is...

But there's always hope!
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline yzj

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #268 on: January 11, 2018, 05:33:27 PM »
@yzj

Please don't misconstrue my words.

I have a very hard time accepting contradictions and duplicity in my life. So when I don't see my husband at least trying or pretending to try to daven, I sometimes feel like it would be easier to just end our commitment to Yiddishkeit and get used to a new lifestyle than to constantly have to grapple with contradictions. This was *not* meant to be taken as a serious consideration of mine.

At this point, I realize that I can't wait for my husband and I have to take control of the life I want for my child. If want ours to be a truly, richly Jewish home- then that is up to me. If my husband wants to contribute- all the better for us!

Got it.

So many spouses never come to the realization that there is so much that they can do to shape their homes, or they may put in effort, but do it in a way that exudes resentment and condescension, thereby undermining any positive influence they may have had on their husbands. Kudos to you for recognizing this. It may take time and be almost imperceptible at first but eventually you will see the richly Jewish home that you desire and have the satisfaction of knowing that it is due to your efforts.

Offline yitzf

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #269 on: January 11, 2018, 05:33:49 PM »
As an aside, Torah Umesorah is rolling out a very comprehensive tefillah curriculum for grades K-8.

From what I've seen, this isn't just another side initiative that quickly becomes an afterthought, rather a serious curriculum with well planned teacher guides for every week of the year (different ones for each grade), and serious buy-in from the Rabbeim/Teachers.

Each grade focuses on a different part of davening and there are 5 parts. I think they are- understanding the meaning of the words, importance of davening, connection to Hashem, inspiration for davening (stories etc), and hanhaga (behavior) during davening.

They are piloting it this year at a Lakewood boys school and are planning on rolling it out to many more schools in the near future.

Offline Z56

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #270 on: January 11, 2018, 06:12:46 PM »
just curious...

when does schmooze, socialize with his friends? Do his friends realize he doesn't come to shul?

I know ppl that don't daven... they just come to hang out in shul.... go figure
“I have nothing in common with lazy people who blame others for their lack of success. Great things come from hard work

Offline Sport

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #271 on: January 11, 2018, 06:12:58 PM »
seems to me the biggest disconnect is the purpose and goal of tefillah not the meaning of the words
That would fall under appreciation of davening.

Offline wayfe

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #272 on: January 11, 2018, 06:33:09 PM »
just curious...

when does schmooze, socialize with his friends? Do his friends realize he doesn't come to shul?

I know ppl that don't daven... they just come to hang out in shul.... go figure

He socialized at work and plays basketball twice a week. I have no idea whether his friends know about this.

Like others have mentioned there are enough shuls and enough minyanim that it doesn't seem obvious if you don't go.

I sometimes wonder whether moving and belonging to an OOT community where shul members are noticed or missed would be a good idea.
"I would rather have questions that can't be answered than answers which can't be questioned."
— Richard Feynman

Online aygart

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #273 on: January 11, 2018, 06:43:57 PM »
He socialized at work and plays basketball twice a week. I have no idea whether his friends know about this.

Like others have mentioned there are enough shuls and enough minyanim that it doesn't seem obvious if you don't go.

I sometimes wonder whether moving and belonging to an OOT community where shul members are noticed or missed would be a good idea.

This is a big part of why R Avigdor Miller felt it was extremely important for a person to be a PART of a kehilla and not just sometimes daven in one place and sometimes another. Davening somewhere that he is part of the kehila would also likely lead him to a greater feeling of fulfillment with it overall. This leads to the question of where he goes when he does go daven.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline Sammy82

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #274 on: January 11, 2018, 06:44:33 PM »
He socialized at work and plays basketball twice a week. I have no idea whether his friends know about this.

Like others have mentioned there are enough shuls and enough minyanim that it doesn't seem obvious if you don't go.

I sometimes wonder whether moving and belonging to an OOT community where shul members are noticed or missed would be a good idea.

Absolutely (like r avigdor Miller says)
But it's definitely doable 'in town' also. Just become part of the right chevra/shul/ minyanim/rabbonim.

Offline mgarfin

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #275 on: January 11, 2018, 07:02:01 PM »
This is a big part of why R Avigdor Miller felt it was extremely important for a person to be a PART of a kehilla and not just sometimes daven in one place and sometimes another. Davening somewhere that he is part of the kehila would also likely lead him to a greater feeling of fulfillment with it overall. This leads to the question of where he goes when he does go daven.

My father asked our Rabbi when he was starting to look for shidduchim for his daughters, what he should look for?
He said to look for a bucher you think will stay part of a kehilla.

Look around at shvacheh ppl most don't have someone who cares for their ruchnies.

Its all these corner shuls were the Rav only cares to have a minyan and is too afraid to take on his mispallim.

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #276 on: January 11, 2018, 07:06:11 PM »
It may be a big help for you to encourage him to go to a type of shul he can feel a part of when he does go.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline chaimmayer

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #277 on: January 11, 2018, 08:21:37 PM »
I sometimes wonder whether moving and belonging to an OOT community where shul members are noticed or missed would be a good idea.
I live in a very oot community.one of the ways people were trying to sell it,to me was the sense of contributing and being needed.  For me it wasn't a selling point but now that I'm here (for many years already) i see how true it is.

It's surprising how few people come to minyan and who does or doesn't come.  Many of the more heimeshe people do not come daily.  What surprised me the most was that even Friday night it's a shvache crowd.  I asked someone in ny at the time if people there could get away with coming just shabbos morning and the answer was unfortunately yes.

Offline HBS

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #278 on: January 11, 2018, 10:07:40 PM »
Absolutely (like r avigdor Miller says)
But it's definitely doable 'in town' also. Just become part of the right chevra/shul/ minyanim/rabbonim.
As someone who has spent a bunch of years out of town, before moving back, I can say that being in the right community, whether out of or in town, is useful. It gives a sense of meaningfulness to your avodah.
But you can find places like that in town, you just have to look harder.

Offline chevron

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Re: Do you Daven?
« Reply #279 on: January 12, 2018, 12:07:40 AM »
I don't go to shull during the week, I'm not lazy, I'm just a self employed person who isn't good with mornings.. I'd like to wake at 6 and bike till 7 and watch the sunrise but I don't.

That doesn't make me a bad person, I still love sunrises and bike riding.