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Author Topic: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread  (Read 188011 times)

Offline aygart

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Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline Chief Rabbi of New York

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Re: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1081 on: April 26, 2023, 02:29:28 PM »
I'm still looking for possible scenario which will make him not guilty, so far I haven't found any. The only question that lies is really what he's guilty for.

Is it possible there is a scenario that you didnít think of?
My only question is r u 100% sure heís guilty before ruining his life ?
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Offline Something Fishy

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Re: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1082 on: April 26, 2023, 03:36:15 PM »
Is it possible there is a scenario that you didnít think of?
My only question is r u 100% sure heís guilty before ruining his life ?

Nobody is ruining anybody's life here, take a deep breath.

And if anyone ruined someone's life it was HG going on a talk show not once but multiple times and shooting his mouth off.
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Offline zale

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Re: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1083 on: April 26, 2023, 05:07:38 PM »
Just trying to understand what is going on, is the current belief that HG deliberately advertised the program in order to defraud his customers or that he had some sort of unforseen catastrophe that he was ashamed to be known for and decided to pull up a story about a scammer?

I think if Dan posts the timeline it might make some things more clear.

You asked for the current belief. Here is my personal (current) belief:

I donít think he created the whole program to defraud people. He simply canít handle money. My belief is that when funds came in he spent a big chunk of it on personal things that have nothing to do with the program. His justification for it might have been ďIím expecting to make $150k profit from the program, so Iíll take my cut nowĒ. I unfortunately know people like this and this is their line of thinking. He was banking on a certain amount of reservations, and that did not happen.

His MO is to push-off paying vendors for as long as possible and until after the program is over, then he either pays off some of it or just leaves the vendors holding the bag.

He probably thought he can pull this off with the Claridge. Pay the first 100k and push off the rest until after the program is over, then just tell them heís in bankruptcy and canít pay. The Claridge was having none of it and warned him that he must pay up. Since he already spent the money, he couldnít pay up, so he starting dodging (as shown in the emails) and then eventually made up a story about phishing to try to convince the hotel that heís serious and will pay up. He was hoping the phishing tale would buy him the time he needs. The hotel must have gotten a sense that heís bluffing and told him to take a hike.

So he was banking on the hotel not asking for the money and having more overall reservations, both of which did not end up happening. Since the hotel is not giving back the deposit and the rest of the money has been spent, there is no money to refund customers.

Disclaimer: this is my personal feeling about this at the given time and with the information available.



Offline Chief Rabbi of New York

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Re: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1084 on: April 26, 2023, 05:39:35 PM »
Does anyone know if he did the lie detector test ?
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Offline yelped

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Re: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1085 on: April 26, 2023, 07:26:23 PM »
Does anyone know if he did the lie detector test ?
Who cares?

Offline Chief Rabbi of New York

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Re: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1086 on: April 26, 2023, 07:33:36 PM »
Who cares?

If it can prove his innocence
Then shouldnít everyone care ?
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Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1087 on: April 26, 2023, 07:38:54 PM »
Polygraphs are entirely unreliable and cannot prove anything

Offline Sammy82

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Re: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1088 on: April 26, 2023, 07:42:33 PM »
If it can prove his innocence
Then shouldnít everyone care ?
I think those who already are ready to burn him at the stake will never be convinced. And most others either don't care enough or feel he has some sort of sickness (ie if another you had yenne machla, you feel bad for him and daven he has a refuah shleima.) Obviously the people affected by him have to protect themselves and will iyh get repaid somehow. But to wish harm on another yid is mind blowing to me.
Throw in that these tests are beatable......
So no, this test isn't going to sway most people either way.
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Offline amaaretz

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Re: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1089 on: April 26, 2023, 07:42:35 PM »
Goooood morning, it's polygraph test day!
And what a beautiful day it was for polygraph test, indeed.

If anyone wants to reach out to that judge who kept plugging his firm throughout the show to follow up and see if it ever happened, be our guest. In the absence of that, we'll assume he "couldn't come because [all sorts of nonsense]".

Offline Chief Rabbi of New York

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Re: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1090 on: April 26, 2023, 07:53:40 PM »
And what a beautiful day it was for polygraph test, indeed.

If anyone wants to reach out to that judge who kept plugging his firm throughout the show to follow up and see if it ever happened, be our guest. In the absence of that, we'll assume he "couldn't come because [all sorts of nonsense]".

So this means guilty until proven innocent ?
Assuming he didnít come until someone reaches out to the judge
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Offline zale

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Re: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1091 on: April 26, 2023, 07:56:04 PM »
Polygraphs are entirely unreliable and cannot prove anything

+1

A sociopath can handily beat the lie detector test.

I think the judge wanted to see if heíll hesitate to agree to take it. He didnít hesitate.

Offline amaaretz

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Re: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1092 on: April 26, 2023, 07:56:16 PM »
So this means guilty until proven innocent ?
Assuming he didnít come until someone reaches out to the judge
You keep creating straw-men to engage with & gaslight people. This response is an acknowledgement of that, but I'm not engaging in a back and forth with you.
Nothing personal, I just don't have it in me. The situation speaks for itself. Be well.

Offline amaaretz

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Re: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1093 on: April 26, 2023, 08:13:53 PM »
+1

A sociopath can handily beat the lie detector test.

I think the judge wanted to see if heíll hesitate to agree to take it. He didnít hesitate.
I think the judge was being genuine with his offer. He acknowledged on-air that polygraphs are not conclusive - they're not even admissable in court - but it's still something.
And he also wanted HG to say he'll come & never show up, which I assume is what happened.

Offline yuneeq

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Re: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1094 on: April 27, 2023, 03:52:50 AM »
Polygraphs are fully unreliable, full stop. The 2 cases where it was used in my circles - one gave a false positive and the other a false negative. The case of the false negative was regarding theft, the person was nervous and failed the test, it wasnít until years later that someone else admitted to taking the money. And the other case a friend told me he beat the test regarding his drug usage with a little prep.
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Offline Yehuda25

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Re: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1095 on: April 27, 2023, 08:05:58 AM »
I'm more surprised that people don't use their credit cards to pay for the programs. Or do none of the programs actually take credit card? Would be well worth a 3% fee for the protection.
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Offline Dan

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Re: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1096 on: April 27, 2023, 08:37:14 AM »
They don't take credit cards.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Alexsei

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Re: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1097 on: April 27, 2023, 08:46:40 AM »
They don't take credit cards.
Wow wouldn't they get many more customers if they did?
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Offline JMHO

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Re: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1098 on: April 27, 2023, 08:53:36 AM »
Wow wouldn't they get many more customers if they did?
They can get away without taking cc... not worth dealing with every dispute, etc...

Offline stmark

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Re: Pesach Program Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1099 on: April 27, 2023, 10:56:04 AM »
They don't take credit cards.
Went on a program 2 years ago and they allowed 50% to be paid on a cc. opened an ink in my name and my wifes and got the points and enjoyed yuntif in the hotel (tri state program still in existence).