Author Topic: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)  (Read 154813 times)

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #540 on: June 23, 2022, 11:48:32 AM »
The magazine very clearly pushed a feminist agenda glorifying a career woman as an ends in and of itself. There have been cover features glorifying divorce and single motherhood etc. He is very obviously trying to use the magazine to advance an agenda.

See, this is more helpful. You're providing examples of the type of "agenda" they might be pushing which may run counter to "Chareidi" hashkafah.

The problem that I (and I think many others) have with the Mishpacha is their lack of honesty.

They presented themselves as one thing in order to get into people's homes, and then slowly started pushing their agenda of "liberalization."

I didn't watch the interview, but the quotes posted seem to indicate that this move is deliberate, not a natural evolution.

Another issue in these discussions is the use of terms like conservative and liberal. Do you mean politically, socially, or something else?

What does Paley mean when he uses the terms? What does @Moshe Green mean? I'm willing to wager you'd each say something else.

P. S. I ain't no shill for mishpacha. Don't think I've ever bought a single issue.

Offline TimT

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #541 on: June 23, 2022, 11:50:47 AM »
Don't think I've ever bought a single issue.
Buy a few & report back :)

Offline zh cohen

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #542 on: June 23, 2022, 11:52:57 AM »
The problem that I (and I think many others) have with the Mishpacha is their lack of honesty.

They presented themselves as one thing in order to get into people's homes, and then slowly started pushing their agenda of "liberalization."

I didn't watch the interview, but the quotes posted seem to indicate that this move is deliberate, not a natural evolution.

 The changes are often subtle, and things that on their own might not be objectionable.

But when they are part of a deliberate effort to push the frum community into a specific direction, it is a major problem.

Offline zh cohen

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #543 on: June 23, 2022, 11:54:55 AM »
Another issue in these discussions is the use of terms like conservative and liberal. Do you mean politically, socially, or something else?

What does Paley mean when he uses the terms? What does @Moshe Green mean? I'm willing to wager you'd each say something else.

I don't think this matters. My issue is then presenting themselves as one thing while actually being something else.

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #544 on: June 23, 2022, 12:07:50 PM »
Buy a few & report back :)

I'm a contrarian not a masochist

Offline biobook

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #545 on: June 23, 2022, 12:15:15 PM »
Buy a few & report back :)
Or read them online.
https://mishpacha.com/magazine/mishpacha/

This issue has a divorce cover feature, but doesn't seem to glorify it, rather "push for a halachically compatible prenup"
https://mishpacha.com/magazine/mishpacha-788/

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #546 on: June 23, 2022, 12:24:35 PM »


This issue has a divorce cover feature, but doesn't seem to glorify it, rather "push for a halachically compatible prenup"
https://mishpacha.com/magazine/mishpacha-788/

I suspected that actually reading the pieces might give me a different feeling for "glorifying", but I respect Aygart to give him the benefit of the doubt prior to reading.

Offline biobook

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #547 on: June 23, 2022, 12:32:47 PM »
I suspected that actually reading the pieces might give me a different feeling for "glorifying", but I respect Aygart to give him the benefit of the doubt prior to reading.
I wrote "a divorce cover feature" because I wasn't sure if this is the one Aygart meant.

Online Ver hut gazugt

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #548 on: June 23, 2022, 01:10:11 PM »
I suspected that actually reading the pieces might give me a different feeling for "glorifying", but I respect Aygart to give him the benefit of the doubt prior to reading.
from the headline it seems they are pushing it hard. 
Personally, I think it’s distasteful to have the issue of divorce on the front cover.

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #549 on: June 23, 2022, 01:16:49 PM »
Personally, I think it’s distasteful to have the issue of divorce on the front cover.

Yup, with my shas set I hide the Gittin behind the Avoda Zarah. For the mishnayos set I hide the entire Zeraim in case my kids think I'm glorifying being a farmer.


Online Euclid

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #550 on: June 23, 2022, 01:21:47 PM »
Yup, with my shas set I hide the Gittin behind the Avoda Zarah. For the mishnayos set I hide the entire Zeraim in case my kids think I'm glorifying being a farmer.
I personally heard R' Elya Baruch Finkel in middle of a shiur ask for a niddah or a sotah (forgot which one), and with a twinkle in his eye add "a gemara niddah/sotah".

Offline zh cohen

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #551 on: June 23, 2022, 01:22:30 PM »
For the mishnayos set I hide the entire Zeraim in case my kids think I'm glorifying being a farmer.

#NicheJokesFTW

Offline yelped

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #552 on: June 23, 2022, 01:22:53 PM »
from the headline it seems they are pushing it hard. 
Personally, I think it’s distasteful to have the issue of divorce on the front cover.
Sure, it's distasteful to cover unpleasant topics, but it has to be done.

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #553 on: June 23, 2022, 01:30:40 PM »
Yup, with my shas set I hide the Gittin behind the Avoda Zarah. For the mishnayos set I hide the entire Zeraim in case my kids think I'm glorifying being a farmer.
How can you compare the two ?
I said nothing about glorifying, I said its poor taste.

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #554 on: June 23, 2022, 01:31:52 PM »
Sure, it's distasteful to cover unpleasant topics, but it has to be done.
big difference between talking about a subject and splashing it on the front page with a catchy provocative title.

Offline yelped

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #555 on: June 23, 2022, 01:33:24 PM »
big difference between talking about a subject and splashing it on the front page with a catchy provocative title.
I don't see that as something to get worked up about. Not everything is perfect, but ultimately, you have to judge about what produces better fruit.

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #556 on: June 23, 2022, 03:17:40 PM »
I don't see that as something to get worked up about.

Agreed. Maybe over text it sounds stronger then I intended.

In regards to the issue, prenup shouldn’t be the answer.

Offline yelped

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #557 on: June 23, 2022, 03:25:31 PM »
Agreed. Maybe over text it sounds stronger then I intended.

In regards to the issue, prenup shouldn’t be the answer.
Possibly, I am not that familiar.

Offline Moshe Green

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #558 on: June 23, 2022, 03:59:30 PM »
I don't see that as something to get worked up about. Not everything is perfect, but ultimately, you have to judge about what produces better fruit.

do the ends always justify the means?
100% not everything is perfect, but if going about fixing the issue is against halacha or breaks healthy boundaries then it should not be done. 2 wrongs don't make a right.

Offline yelped

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Re: Torah & Hashkafa Questions (PC Free For All)
« Reply #559 on: June 23, 2022, 05:43:54 PM »
do the ends always justify the means?
100% not everything is perfect, but if going about fixing the issue is against halacha or breaks healthy boundaries then it should not be done. 2 wrongs don't make a right.
You can not buy it if you're uncomfortable with it, that doesn't mean it's against the halacha.