Restaurants In Israel Master Thread

[davidd75]

There are people in the leadership who are well known not be honest.

I personally eat dairy but not meat unless I can find info on specific Shechita.
Nothing. ETA Maybe certain parts of animals according to some Poskim, unlike RMF, that Asheknazim should not eat it since they lack Mesorah.

not honest that triclkles down to affect kashrus/shechita?
which parts is Machpoud meikel.  I doubt beis yosef shechita practically compromies ashkenazi laws?

[davidd75]

There are people in the leadership who are well known not be honest.

I personally eat dairy but not meat unless I can find info on specific Shechita.
Nothing. ETA Maybe certain parts of animals according to some Poskim, unlike RMF, that Asheknazim should not eat it since they lack Mesorah.

RMF?

[PlatinumGuy]

I doubt beis yosef shechita practically compromies ashkenazi laws?

It doesn't

which parts is Machpoud meikel.

RMF?

Kula is probably not the right word but he's machshir Sirloin and Fillet Mignon that some Ashkenazi poskim held we can't rely on because we don't have a Mesorah how to do it. I believe RMF held that we can rely on their Messorah.

[moko]

  I believe that is the shitah of Rabbi Tendler, Source that Rav Moshe held that way?

Straight out in IG"M

[yungermanchik]

Straight out in IG"M

You're right I just found it Y"D 2 42.
It's just interesting that the one who I asked, someone who generally follows the psakim of Rav Moshe, said to avoid these fancy meats in Machpoud restaurants.

[Dan]

You're right I just found it Y"D 2 42.
It's just interesting that the one who I asked, someone who generally follows the psakim of Rav Moshe, said to avoid these fancy meats in Machpoud restaurants.

I asked and was told it was fine.

[yungermanchik]

their issue might not be the nikur

specifically the fancy meats that don't really mean the same thing here and we discuss that regular burgers are fine because they wouldn't use those cuts for burgers and even if a bit was mixed in, a chumrah is battel b'rov.

[moko]

I asked and was told it was fine.

if your relying on his hashgacha, it would seem to be.
Rumor has it that although he held there was an actual minhag not to eat אחוריים, Harav MYLL went to learn nikur by R Machpud , שלא תשכח תורת ניקור

[moko]

specifically the fancy meats that don't really mean the same thing here and we discuss that regular burgers are fine because they wouldn't use those cuts for burgers and even if a bit was mixed in, a chumrah is battel b'rov.

I re-read and deleted my post

[ExGingi]

Rav Ovadias ztl hecsher you would not touch?

Is he there supervising or even setting policy? Did you get his comments about the Poland cheese fiasco that was under Badatz Beit-Yosef?

Give me a break, invoking his name at this point is just a marketing tactic just like the meaningless words "badatz" and "mehadrin".

[davidd75]

Is he there supervising or even setting policy? Did you get his comments about the Poland cheese fiasco that was under Badatz Beit-Yosef?

Give me a break, invoking his name at this point is just a marketing tactic just like the meaningless words "badatz" and "mehadrin".

didnt he and his sons set the tone intially?  I always assumed it was a strong hechser with a stringent laws etccc

where are they lenient these days?

[JMHO]

Rav Ovadias ztl hecsher you would not touch?

Is he there supervising or even setting policy?

[ExGingi]

didnt he and his sons set the tone intially?  I always assumed it was a strong hechser with a stringent laws etccc

where are they lenient these days?

Never assume. From what I read online it is his youngest son Moshe who runs it (and might have been the one to establish it). Not really well known as a torah figure like some of his brothers.

If you ask around people in the know, it doesn't have a very good reputation (neither does the other hechsher involved in the Poland cheese fiasco - the common denominator between those two is that they are run by business people rather than Halachic authorities).

[ExGingi]

Do you have any substantive comment?

[PlatinumGuy]

Never assume. From what I read online it is his youngest son Moshe who runs it (and might have been the one to establish it). Not really well known as a torah figure like some of his brothers.

If you ask around people in the know, it doesn't have a very good reputation (neither does the other hechsher involved in the Poland cheese fiasco - the common denominator between those two is that they are run by business people rather than Halachic authorities).

The vast majority of them are just as in it for the money.

אל תתיראי מן הפרושין ולא ממי שאינן פרושין, אלא מן הצבועים שדומים לפרושין; שמעשיהם מעשה זמרי ומבקשים שכר כפינחס

Its a morbidly embarrassing Chilul Hashem how these Kashrus Agencies treat proprietors who switch to a competing Kashrus. And yes, I know it firsthand.

The main reason Beis Yosef isn't up to par is that their Tzibbur isn't as Machmir and doesn't hold them to the same standard. (That includes R Ovadia's Psakim as opposed to mainstream Ashkenazi poskim, although not the main problem)

[JMHO]

Do you have any substantive comment?

Yes. We're you really asking if someone who passed away 9 years ago is active in a current operation?
When this Rebbe died, he really died!

[aygart]

Yes. We're you really asking if someone who passed away 9 years ago is active in a current operation?
When this Rebbe died, he really died!

I think that is exactly his point. In what way is it

Rav Ovadias ztl hecsher?

[moko]

The vast majority of them are just as in it for the money.

אל תתיראי מן הפרושין ולא ממי שאינן פרושין, אלא מן הצבועים שדומים לפרושין; שמעשיהם מעשה זמרי ומבקשים שכר כפינחס

Its a morbidly embarrassing Chilul Hashem how these Kashrus Agencies treat proprietors who switch to a competing Kashrus. And yes, I know it firsthand.

The main reason Beis Yosef isn't up to par is that their Tzibbur isn't as Machmir and doesn't hold them to the same standard. (That includes R Ovadia's Psakim as opposed to mainstream Ashkenazi poskim, although not the main problem)

that's a pretty harsh statement. I don't know which most your referring too.
I suspect I have significantly more firsthand knowledge about Kashrus practices both in the US and Israel, and while there is, unfortunately, a lot of rif-raf amongst small and large agencies alike, that's still quite harsh.
.   I think it's incorrect to say that most individuals are in it solely for the money.
Our agency, and many other communal agencies, lose money certifying food service establishments every day.
Believe it or not, we sit for the community.
For 18months of COVID our agency didn't charge a dollar for community food service mad even subsidized the pay for a working mashgichim (what's know in Israel as a ne'eman Kashrut).
Despite all the negativity, there's still some idealism out there.

[Spoon]

beis yosef shechita

No such thing

Never assume. From what I read online it is his youngest son Moshe who runs it (and might have been the one to establish it). Not really well known as a torah figure like some of his brothers.

If you ask around people in the know, it doesn't have a very good reputation (neither does the other hechsher involved in the Poland cheese fiasco - the common denominator between those two is that they are run by business people rather than Halachic authorities).

R Moshe does run it although it was started by R Ovadia and yes it hasn't had the best reputation(although R Yitzchak does eat it FWIW) but there have been efforts over the years to improve the operations. It's definitely not what it was in the earlier years. There have been times when people I trust have said it's good, although I've recently been told to stay away from the meat as someone integral on the meat side has left the organization.

Bottom line-AYLOR

[ExGingi]

that's a pretty harsh statement. I don't know which most your referring too.
I suspect I have significantly more firsthand knowledge about Kashrus practices both in the US and Israel, and while there is, unfortunately, a lot of rif-raf amongst small and large agencies alike, that's still quite harsh.
.   I think it's incorrect to say that most individuals are in it solely for the money.
Our agency, and many other communal agencies, lose money certifying food service establishments every day.
Believe it or not, we sit for the community.
For 18months of COVID our agency didn't charge a dollar for community food service mad even subsidized the pay for a working mashgichim (what's know in Israel as a ne'eman Kashrut).
Despite all the negativity, there's still some idealism out there.

Thanks for the sober and fair post.

There are some hechsherim that are known to have been established for political reasons. When politics plays an underlying role, it could taint the standards even beyond the financial motivations.