Modern Refrigerators and "Shabbos Mode"

[ChaimMoskowitz]

Can't you just have the refrigerator plugged into a switched outlet or am I missing something?

[yesitsme]

Can't you just have the refrigerator plugged into a switched outlet or am I missing something?

The problem is modern refrigerators have chips that counts and detects when you open/close doors and operate based and your direct intervention so its not a gromo, even though the bulb doesn't go on or off their are other actions that respond IE Compressor goes on etc,

On shabbos its prohibited for a jew to opening/closing electrical circuits, you may have appliances that operate on shabbbos on its own cycle Example timer.. old refrigerators went on based on temperature only.

[stooges44]

This topic needs much more awareness.

So what should I do?

[ChaimMoskowitz]

The problem is modern refrigerators have chips that counts and detects when you open/close doors and operate based and your direct intervention so its not a gromo, even though the bulb doesn't go on or off their are other actions that respond IE Compressor goes on etc,

On shabbos its prohibited for a jew to opening/closing electrical circuits, you may have appliances that operate on shabbbos on its own cycle Example timer.. old refrigerators went on based on temperature only.

Sorry I wasn't clear. When it is plugged into a switched outlet you just turn the switch off for Shabbos. There is no power going to the refrigerator. After Shabbos you just turn the switch back on.

We had a switch installed for our whirlpool tub so the kids could not turn it on by accident. Switch was in the linen closet.   

[yesitsme]

Sorry I wasn't clear. When it is plugged into a switched outlet you just turn the switch off for Shabbos. There is no power going to the refrigerator. After Shabbos you just turn the switch back on.

We had a switch installed for our whirlpool tub so the kids could not turn it on by accident. Switch was in the linen closet.

So you're suggesting to have the fridge turned off and spoil the food or i'm missing something.

Shabbos mode doesn't turn the fridge off it puts the compressor on a cycle based on interval turns the light off..... depending on the device

IE in whirlpool ovens:
Modes and features during Sabbath Mode:
If you want to use any of the modes and features listed below, they must be turned on prior to setting/enabling Sabbath Mode:

Oven light - Oven light status will remain in the state they were in before entering Sabbath Mode
The oven light will not respond to the (Oven Light) key or the door position switches.
The warming drawer (select models) must be turned on before starting Sabbath Mode. Once in Sabbath Mode the Warming Drawer settings cannot be changed.
The Warming Zone (select models) must be activated before starting Sabbath Mode. Once in Sabbath Mode, the Warming Zone settings cannot be changed.
Cook top elements/burners may be operated during Sabbath Mode.


Modes or features disabled while in Sabbath Mode:

12 Hour Shutoff
All tones and chimes
All cooking and cleaning modes except for Bake (main cavity and warming drawer).
Timers
Cooktop Lockout (if applicable)
Energy Save (Select Models)
All keys are disabled except for:
START, CANCEL or OFF
Warming Zone ON/Off (Select Models)
Warming Drawer Cancel (Select Models)

https://producthelp.whirlpool.com/Cooking/Wall_Ovens_and_Ranges/Oven_Product_Assistance/Sabbath_Mode

GE Fridge
https://products.geappliances.com/appliance/gea-support-search-content?contentId=17357

[ChaimMoskowitz]

So you're suggesting to have the fridge turned off and spoil the food or i'm missing something.

Probably I am the you missing something on this one. You are allowed to have the compressor cycle during Shabbos?

[yesitsme]

Probably I am the you missing something on this one. You are allowed to have the compressor cycle during Shabbos?

As long as you're not directly causing it to go on/off

[ChaimMoskowitz]

As long as you're not directly causing it to go on/off

Got it. So things like central air is ok to cycle on and off?

[ExGingi]

Sorry I wasn't clear. When it is plugged into a switched outlet you just turn the switch off for Shabbos. There is no power going to the refrigerator. After Shabbos you just turn the switch back on.

We had a switch installed for our whirlpool tub so the kids could not turn it on by accident. Switch was in the linen closet.

Essentially this is what the Zman Technologies and Supco devices do. They switch the outlet off on a timed cycle, and provide you with a visual indicator of when the outlet is off, and when it's on, as well as when it's about to switch on or off.

[ExGingi]

Got it. So things like central air is ok to cycle on and off?

If the thermostat is located directly where opening or closing the door might have an immediate effect, that could be a problem.

[yesitsme]

Essentially this is what the Zman Technologies and Supco devices do. They switch the outlet off on a timed cycle, and provide you with a visual indicator of when the outlet is off, and when it's on, as well as when it's about to switch on or off.

why the indicator? how does help you?

[ExGingi]

why the indicator? how does help you?

It helps to know when one use the refrigerator and when to avoid using it.

[ushdadude]

Sorry I wasn't clear. When it is plugged into a switched outlet you just turn the switch off for Shabbos. There is no power going to the refrigerator. After Shabbos you just turn the switch back on.

We had a switch installed for our whirlpool tub so the kids could not turn it on by accident. Switch was in the linen closet.

in theory that would work...but then all your food will spoil

[ChaimMoskowitz]

Thanks for helping me understand. I have many more questions but will save them for if/when this gets moved to JS. 

[stooges44]

Does anyone have the Zman Technologies device? What's the the other device and where do I find it, is it any cheaper?

[ExGingi]

Does anyone have the Zman Technologies device? What's the the other device and where do I find it, is it any cheaper?

My daughter uses Zman Technologies. It has the advantage of automatically setting itself to Shabbos mode based on location and time of year.

You can call up Supco and find out where their device is sold. A 220V version of it is sold in Israel for around ILS 230. US version used to be at this address: http://www.supco.com/web/supco_live/products/SHABBATPRO.html but it's showing page not found now. So I'd say call them to see if they still sell a US version.

[skyguy918]

My daughter uses Zman Technologies. It has the advantage of automatically setting itself to Shabbos mode based on location and time of year.

You can call up Supco and find out where their device is sold. A 220V version of it is sold in Israel for around ILS 230. US version used to be at this address: http://www.supco.com/web/supco_live/products/SHABBATPRO.html but it's showing page not found now. So I'd say call them to see if they still sell a US version.

Just wanted to add, since you mentioned Israel, that they're much more aware/on top of this issue there.

[yesitsme]

Just wanted to add, since you mentioned Israel, that they're much more aware/on top of this issue there.

not necessarily

[ExGingi]

Some back and forth PM with @stooges44 enlightened me a little further regarding Zman Technologies.

It looks like they have two products designed for refrigerators. One (called smart control) will work with any make/model, and essentially fully disconnects power on a timed cycle, with red and green LEDs to indicate when it's OK to open the refrigerator. https://www.zmantechnologies.com/store/fridge.html

The other (called the Shabbos Keeper) is designed to work with specific GE models. Based on this article, it was developed in combination with GE and the OU. it Carries three certifications .

Based on my reading of the article, it seems like the Shabbos mode is built into the refrigerators, and all the device does is set it automatically based on time/date/location. I have not verified this yet, but if anyone has verified this with either GE, Zman Technologies, the OU (or any of the other certifying authorities), it would seem like GE opted to work with the OU instead of the Star-K and that their Shabbos mode might be certified even without the Zman Technologies device.

[stooges44]

Some back and forth PM with @stooges44 enlightened me a little further regarding Zman Technologies.

It looks like they have two products designed for refrigerators. One (called smart control) will work with any make/model, and essentially fully disconnects power on a timed cycle, with red and green LEDs to indicate when it's OK to open the refrigerator. https://www.zmantechnologies.com/store/fridge.html

The other (called the Shabbos Keeper) is designed to work with specific GE models. Based on this article, it was developed in combination with GE and the OU. it Carries three certifications .

Based on my reading of the article, it seems like the Shabbos mode is built into the refrigerators, and all the device does is set it automatically based on time/date/location. I have not verified this yet, but if anyone has verified this with either GE, Zman Technologies, the OU (or any of the other certifying authorities), it would seem like GE opted to work with the OU instead of the Star-K and that their Shabbos mode might be certified even without the Zman Technologies device.

My thoughts also, but then what is the purpose of the Keeper? Just for peace of mind in that it's automatic and it doesn't require you to manually activate and de-activate Shabbos mode?