Author Topic: Amazon HQ2  (Read 13999 times)

Offline Ephraimh

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Re: Amazon HQ2
« Reply #80 on: February 14, 2019, 04:18:12 PM »
The fact that NY needs to bribe amazon to come to NY is proof that NY is not very inviting for business in general. For every job that would be gained by amazon, there may very well be multiple jobs created if NY would offer the same incentives to all businesses (currently in NY or interested in moving to NY), it just doesn't come in one big swoop like amazon. It's a slap in the face to all businesses in NY to admit that it's too expensive to do business in NY, but since you don't help us brag that we brought jobs to the city we'll continue making life difficult for you but make it easy for the behemoth. If that's not called picking winners and losers I don't know what is.
It was discussed in length earlier in the thread, but in a nutshell, when your local deli or even a cut and dry low paying non-tech behemoth, say a car manufacturing plant, receives an incentive to hire employees it more or less ends there, it doesnít necessarily lure in other car companies and it doesnít create a ĎDeli hubí.. high paying tech jobs on the other hand by nature create hubs, improve living conditions, and transform cities.

Offline yesitsme

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Re: Amazon HQ2
« Reply #81 on: February 14, 2019, 04:20:50 PM »
and the yidilach are migrating from NY to NJ ....

Offline avromie7

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Re: Amazon HQ2
« Reply #82 on: February 14, 2019, 04:25:53 PM »
It was discussed in length earlier in the thread, but in a nutshell, when your local deli or even a cut and dry low paying non-tech behemoth, say a car manufacturing plant, receives an incentive to hire employees it more or less ends there, it doesnít necessarily lure in other car companies and it doesnít create a ĎDeli hubí.. high paying tech jobs on the other hand by nature create hubs, improve living conditions, and transform cities.
Another way to get that result is to make it easier to do business. The same way NY is making it easier for Amazon to do business, if they extended that to everyone else you can get the same results or better without choosing winners and losers.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Offline Ephraimh

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Amazon HQ2
« Reply #83 on: February 14, 2019, 04:31:52 PM »
Another way to get that result is to make it easier to do business. The same way NY is making it easier for Amazon to do business, if they extended that to everyone else you can get the same results or better without choosing winners and losers.
Agree with you on overall changing a climate to ease the means of doing business, but, as discussed up thread, NYC didnít pick Amazon here, Amazon picked NYC.

Offline yesitsme

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Re: Amazon HQ2
« Reply #84 on: February 14, 2019, 04:33:06 PM »
Agree with you on overall changing a climate to ease the means of doing business, but, as discussed up thread, NYC didnít pick here Amazon, Amazon picked NYC.
Many states picked Amazon, amazon used process of elimination to pick NYC

Offline Ephraimh

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Amazon HQ2
« Reply #85 on: February 14, 2019, 04:35:45 PM »
Many states picked Amazon, amazon used process of elimination to pick NYC
How come these states didnít fight over your local deli? Exactly my point

Offline avromie7

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Re: Amazon HQ2
« Reply #86 on: February 14, 2019, 04:39:27 PM »
How come these states didnít fight over your local deli? Exactly my point
They actually do, by making a conducive business environment.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Offline Dan

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Re: Amazon HQ2
« Reply #87 on: February 14, 2019, 04:42:35 PM »
They actually do, by making a conducive business environment.
This argument is silliness. Yes, your state should have a competitive tax environment. But lowering rates to lure in a big fish isn't bad policy any more than offering a quantity discount on your product is bad policy. Bigger clients get bigger discounts, especially when they are openly shopping around.

Is that unfair to small business? Perhaps, but that small business isn't going to bring in tens of billions of dollars in tax revenue in one fell swoop.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline aygart

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Re: Amazon HQ2
« Reply #88 on: February 14, 2019, 04:45:49 PM »
This argument is silliness. Yes, your state should have a competitive tax environment. But lowering rates to lure in a big fish isn't bad policy any more than offering a quantity discount on your product is bad policy. Bigger clients get bigger discounts, especially when they are openly shopping around.

Is that unfair to small business? Perhaps, but that small business isn't going to bring in tens of billions of dollars in tax revenue in one fell swoop.
+1

This is similar to a mall giving a big discount to anchor stores to boost the rest of the property. NYC has been lagging in tech for quite some time and this was an oppotunity to catch up squandered.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline stooges44

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Re: Amazon HQ2
« Reply #89 on: February 14, 2019, 04:47:36 PM »
+1

This is similar to a mall giving a big discount to anchor stores to boost the rest of the property. NYC has been lagging in tech for quite some time and this was an oppotunity to catch up squandered.

Amazon is classified as tech?
If it's not free shipping it's not worth it.

Offline skyguy918

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Re: Amazon HQ2
« Reply #90 on: February 14, 2019, 04:48:03 PM »
+1

This is similar to a mall giving a big discount to anchor stores to boost the rest of the property. NYC has been lagging in tech for quite some time and this was an oppotunity to catch up squandered.
That's actually the central question though. Should governments be operating like businesses or not.

Offline Ephraimh

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Re: Amazon HQ2
« Reply #91 on: February 14, 2019, 04:48:42 PM »

Offline yesitsme

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Re: Amazon HQ2
« Reply #92 on: February 14, 2019, 04:49:01 PM »
This argument is silliness. Yes, your state should have a competitive tax environment. But lowering rates to lure in a big fish isn't bad policy any more than offering a quantity discount on your product is bad policy. Bigger clients get bigger discounts, especially when they are openly shopping around.

Is that unfair to small business? Perhaps, but that small business isn't going to bring in tens of billions of dollars in tax revenue in one fell swoop.
while you have a point, there's a difference between offering a discount and taxing you because you made money.
The way it works here is
business is growing? pay more, getting better? pay even more (tax the rich), making even more? we will give you a discount to operate in NYC.

all these major tax incentives you hear is from the giant companies, while they scream tax the millionaires, BTW with a million dollars you could buy a condo not a house.

Offline Ephraimh

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Re: Amazon HQ2
« Reply #93 on: February 14, 2019, 04:50:24 PM »
That's actually the central question though. Should governments be operating like businesses or not.
Governments go down when they stop operating like a business

Offline Dan

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Re: Amazon HQ2
« Reply #94 on: February 14, 2019, 04:52:05 PM »
while you have a point, there's a difference between offering a discount and taxing you because you made money.
The way it works here is
business is growing? pay more, getting better? pay even more (tax the rich), making even more? we will give you a discount to operate in NYC.

all these major tax incentives you hear is from the giant companies, while they scream tax the millionaires, BTW with a million dollars you could buy a condo not a house.
It's all about negotiating power. Amazon has it and cities had to decide if they wanted to play that game.
Clearly most cities were willing to.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline stooges44

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Re: Amazon HQ2
« Reply #95 on: February 14, 2019, 04:52:13 PM »
Or?

Intel, Microsoft, Apple, AMD, HP, Dell to name a bunch are tech. Amazon.. I don't see how they fit in with those. AWS yes but not Amazon as a whole.
If it's not free shipping it's not worth it.

Offline yeshivabucher

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Re: Amazon HQ2
« Reply #96 on: February 14, 2019, 04:54:41 PM »
This argument is silliness. Yes, your state should have a competitive tax environment. But lowering rates to lure in a big fish isn't bad policy any more than offering a quantity discount on your product is bad policy. Bigger clients get bigger discounts, especially when they are openly shopping around.

Is that unfair to small business? Perhaps, but that small business isn't going to bring in tens of billions of dollars in tax revenue in one fell swoop.
if this was a private businesses  giving incentives thats their own purview but this is a government giving subsides to a businesses  which basically undercuts any competition in the state and uses your tax dollars to do it and if they want to encourage more businesses they shouldn't have such a high tax rate in the first place

Offline Dan

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Re: Amazon HQ2
« Reply #97 on: February 14, 2019, 04:57:02 PM »
if this was a private businesses  giving incentives thats their own purview but this is a government giving subsides to a businesses  which basically undercuts any competition in the state and uses your tax dollars to do it and if they want to encourage more businesses they shouldn't have such a high tax rate in the first place
Your tax dollars? It's a rebate of a small percentage of the additional tax dollars that HQ2 would bring in. They were never yours in the first place and now DC or BNA will get them.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Ephraimh

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Amazon HQ2
« Reply #98 on: February 14, 2019, 04:57:47 PM »
Intel, Microsoft, Apple, AMD, HP, Dell to name a bunch are tech. Amazon.. I don't see how they fit in with those. AWS yes but not Amazon as a whole.
Amazon directly competes with Goggle, Microsoft, Apple, and Netflix between AWS, ads, video on demand, and home assistant..

Not only does Amazon fit with them but they compete and win on many fronts..

Offline avromie7

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Re: Amazon HQ2
« Reply #99 on: February 14, 2019, 04:58:24 PM »
Governments go down when they stop operating like a business
What does that even mean?
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.