Lakewood NJ Master Thread

[Euclid]

https://lakewoodalerts.com/breaking-assembly-panel-approves-revolutionary-private-school-transportation-bill/

I am having a hard time figuring out why this bill is supported by Agudah. To me it seems like a disaster. Am I missing something?

1. This bill totally eliminates courtesy bussing.
2. Even mandated bussing can only be up to the aid in lieu amount. Once it exceeds that the consortium pays AIL to the parent and is done. As mentioned in the article, AIL is not nearly enough to cover transportation. This will leave our children with no bussing at all even if they are mandated!

https://www.njleg.state.nj.us/bill-search/2022/A5412
https://legiscan.com/NJ/text/A5412/2022

If the per pupil cost of the lowest bid received
exceeds the aid in-lieu-of transportation amount, then the parent or
guardian of the student shall be eligible to receive the aid in-lieu-of
transportation amount from the consortium for that school year.

How does it currently work?

[Eb228]

Where can I rent a phone for overseas (not Israel)?

[YitzyS]

https://lakewoodalerts.com/breaking-assembly-panel-approves-revolutionary-private-school-transportation-bill/

I am having a hard time figuring out why this bill is supported by Agudah. To me it seems like a disaster. Am I missing something?

1. This bill totally eliminates courtesy bussing.
2. Even mandated bussing can only be up to the aid in lieu amount. Once it exceeds that the consortium pays AIL to the parent and is done. As mentioned in the article, AIL is not nearly enough to cover transportation. This will leave our children with no bussing at all even if they are mandated!

https://www.njleg.state.nj.us/bill-search/2022/A5412
https://legiscan.com/NJ/text/A5412/2022

I just spoke to Shlomo Schorr of Agudah and asked him to look at your comment. He said that he does not know where you see point #1, as there is no mention of that anywhere. Courtesy bussing never was a law, rather a personal arrangement between each individual school district and the parents/guardians of children in that district. That will continue unabated.

As per point #2, it always was the case that transportation mandates cap at the AIL amount, and if it is more, the district just writes a check in lieu of providing busing (hence the title). Now, that check will be able to go to a consortium to which courtesy parents will be able to pay into..

Those payments, combined with the savings incurred by the consortium when taking over the busing routes from the district, allows for more mandated children to receive busing, as well as the courtesy children.

If you have any questions, you can post them and I'll pass them on.

[aygart]

I just spoke to Shlomo Schorr of Agudah and asked him to look at your comment. He said that he does not know where you see point #1, as there is no mention of that anywhere. Courtesy bussing never was a law, rather a personal arrangement between each individual school district and the parents/guardians of children in that district. That will continue unabated.

As per point #2, it always was the case that transportation mandates cap at the AIL amount, and if it is more, the district just writes a check in lieu of providing busing (hence the title). Now, that check will be able to go to a consortium to which courtesy parents will be able to pay into..

Those payments, combined with the savings incurred by the consortium when taking over the busing routes from the district, allows for more mandated children to receive busing, as well as the courtesy children.

If you have any questions, you can post them and I'll pass them on.

Thank you

school district that chooses to participate in the program shall disburse to the consortium an amount equal to the aid in-lieu-of transportation amount for each nonpublic school pupil who is attending a nonpublic school which is a part of the consortium and who is required to be transported by the school district pursuant to N.J.S.18A:39-

[YitzyS]

Thank you

school district that chooses to participate in the program shall disburse to the consortium an amount equal to the aid in-lieu-of transportation amount for each nonpublic school pupil who is attending a nonpublic school which is a part of the consortium and who is required to be transported by the school district pursuant to N.J.S.18A:39-

I'm not understanding what you see in this?

[aygart]

I'm not understanding what you see in this?

Required

and who is required to be transported by the school district pursuant to N.J.S.18A:39-

To clarify, the bill only authorizes the consortium to provide and does not provide any framework for Courtesy busing. Also currently the district has the option although not the requirement of paying more than the payment in lieu this bill does not allow such a thing.

[YitzyS]

I think I know the answers myself, so I'm not going to call Shlomo, but I will be more than happy to if you are not satisfied with my answers

To clarify, the bill only authorizes the consortium to provide and does not provide any framework for Courtesy busing.

True, because courtesy busing was never part of any legal framework. The school district would be able to give the money to a non-government consortium, who would be able to supply busing however they (and the parents/district) want them to. Being the the consortium is a private entity, they would only hire a consortium who will do it how they want it done, which is with the inclusion of courtesy busing.

Remember, the district wants as many students bused as possible. Until now, they have no legal recourse to outsource the busing to a private company. Now they finally have that option. And of course, they will pick a private company that will service all the students.

Also currently the district has the option although not the requirement of paying more than the payment in lieu this bill does not allow such a thing.

-1.

It is currently illegal for a district to pay more than the AIL cap for busing. If busing a student will cost more than that limit, they don't have a choice, and they must instead issue a check.


As an aside, there are also other benefits to using a private company. They have the option to bid 3-year contracts, instead of just one-year contracts. Also, like in the case of the LSTA, they had access to expensive programs that optimized routes much better than the public districts were able to.

[aygart]

I think I know the answers myself, so I'm not going to call Shlomo, but I will be more than happy to if you are not satisfied with my answers
True, because courtesy busing was never part of any legal framework. The school district would be able to give the money to a non-government consortium, who would be able to supply busing however they (and the parents/district) want them to. Being the the consortium is a private entity, they would only hire a consortium who will do it how they want it done, which is with the inclusion of courtesy busing.

Remember, the district wants as many students bused as possible. Until now, they have no legal recourse to outsource the busing to a private company. Now they finally have that option. And of course, they will pick a private company that will service all the students.
-1.

It is currently illegal for a district to pay more than the AIL cap for busing. If busing a student will cost more than that limit, they don't have a choice, and they must instead issue a check.


As an aside, there are also other benefits to using a private company. They have the option to bid 3-year contracts, instead of just one-year contracts. Also, like in the case of the LSTA, they had access to expensive programs that optimized routes much better than the public districts were able to.

The law as published in NJ Rev Stat § 18A:39-1 (2022) mandates bussing of the costs are below PIL. I could not found anywhere prohibiting higher amounts, but did find this which seems to allow it and seems to be the source to allow courtesy bussing. Do you have a source for it being illegal?

18A:39-1.1 Transportation of other pupils by board.

18A:39-1.1. In addition to the provision of transportation for pupils pursuant to N.J.S.18A:39-1 and N.J.S.18A:46-23, the board of education of any district may provide, by contract or otherwise, in accordance with law and the rules and regulations of the State board, for the transportation of other pupils to and from school.

Districts shall not receive State transportation aid pursuant to section 15 of P.L.2007, c.260 (C.18A:7F-57) for the transportation of pupils pursuant to this section.

This bill has no provision allowing the consortium to do anything more than mandated bussing at below PIL. If it is not in there then they can't do it whether or not it makes sense. I don't think your svara that they can pay for it just like they do now is true if the law does not provide for it.

[YitzyS]

The law as published in NJ Rev Stat § 18A:39-1 (2022) mandates bussing of the costs are below PIL. I could not found anywhere prohibiting higher amounts, but did find this which seems to allow it and seems to be the source to allow courtesy bussing. Do you have a source for it being illegal?

18A:39-1.1 Transportation of other pupils by board.

18A:39-1.1. In addition to the provision of transportation for pupils pursuant to N.J.S.18A:39-1 and N.J.S.18A:46-23, the board of education of any district may provide, by contract or otherwise, in accordance with law and the rules and regulations of the State board, for the transportation of other pupils to and from school.

Districts shall not receive State transportation aid pursuant to section 15 of P.L.2007, c.260 (C.18A:7F-57) for the transportation of pupils pursuant to this section.

This bill has no provision allowing the consortium to do anything more than mandated bussing at below PIL. If it is not in there then they can't do it whether or not it makes sense. I don't think your svara that they can pay for it just like they do now is true if the law does not provide for it.

I'm not familiar with the specific laws, but I just called Shlomo and he told me that there is a law saying that it's illegal to pay more than AIL, and that courtesy busing does not have to be included in the law to be allowed. I'll try to get more clarification tomorrow.

He also added an important point, that this is an opt-in law, and no district is forced to do anything. If a district is fine with the status quo, then nothing changes.

[aygart]

I'm not familiar with the specific laws, but I just called Shlomo and he told me that there is a law saying that it's illegal to pay more than AIL, and that courtesy busing does not have to be included in the law to be allowed. I'll try to get more clarification tomorrow.

He also added an important point, that this is an opt-in law, and no district is forced to do anything. If a district is fine with the status quo, then nothing changes.

It is very possible that I am misunderstanding. I do not claim any expertise here.

[YitzyS]

Here is the language allowing districts to provide courtesy busing. The new bill does not affect this ability.

6A:27-1.4"
District boards of education may provide for the transportation of students who reside less than remote from their school in accordance with district board of education policies and at the school district’s expense. District boards of education may elect to charge the parent or legal guardian for all or part of the cost of this service in accordance with N.J.S.A. 18A:39-1.3.


And here is the language prohibiting districts from spending more than what is allowed for nonpublic school transportation:

The resident district board of education shall not expend more than the maximum per student expenditure for nonpublic school transportation in accordance with N.J.S.A. 18A:39-1.
Expenditures for nonpublic school transportation shall be limited to the annual maximum statutorily established amount per student in accordance with N.J.S.A. 18A:39-1. If the cost of transportation to the nonpublic school exceeds this amount, the resident district board of education shall not provide transportation but instead shall pay aid in lieu of transportation to the student’s parents or legal guardians.

[Definitions]

Are there quiet beaches nearby?

[Randomex]

Are there quiet beaches nearby?

According to a couple of my family members, Mantoloking and possibly Avon.

[WayBackMachine]

[Tuna Baygel]

Who in the area can assist with writing a will at a reasonable rate?

[mlight]

Where's the best place to get a tallis cleaned?

[Realshlomo]

Where's the best place to get a tallis cleaned?

Torah treasures

[WonderingYid]

According to a couple of my family members, Mantoloking and possibly Avon.

Not anymore 🤠

[davidd75]

anybody take a cybersecurity course/enrolled in a program or know someone that did that can shed some recommendations, experience, pitfalls?

This is for bais midrash boy who wants to do this on the side.

[shlomoandtam]

Who in the area can assist with writing a will at a reasonable rate?

Joe Klein from Korsinsky & Klein