Matisyahu Shaves Beard...

[sguitarist18]

I agree that it's tough either way, I think some parts of pop culture are tougher than others. Admittedly, I'm not such a sports fan, but my impression is that basketball rarely involves crowd surfing...

Would you approve of having an interfaith prayer if they were saying psalms?

[Dan]

They don't even compare to teenage groupies. Not even close. This is besides that a BT needs to be more careful.

Matisyahu didn't have teenage groupies, he's not some boy band.
BB players probably have more teenage groupies than he did.

[Dan]

I agree that it's tough either way, I think some parts of pop culture are tougher than others. Admittedly, I'm not such a sports fan, but my impression is that basketball rarely involves crowd surfing...

Would you approve of having an interfaith prayer if they were saying psalms?

He didn't crowd surf until many years into it when he started going downhill AFAIK.

I'm not sure it's fair to call it an interfaith prayer.  Is singing Gd Bless America at the baseball game an interfaith prayer?
For all I know he asked I rov at that point in time. Personally I don't know.

[sguitarist18]

For most, God Bless America is not religious, it's patriotic. Plus, there may be lots of different faiths, but it's not specific - in other words, you're not saying, "hey, I'd like to sing god bless america with some people from other religions." Generally. I think.

I don't know the timeline of his uphills and downhills. I remember hearing about it a while back, a quick google shows as early as mid-2009.

[Dan]

I don't know the timeline of his uphills and downhills. I remember hearing about it a while back, a quick google shows as early as mid-2009.

Seems like he was played in bands in the mid 90s as a teen, was mekarev by Chabad in 98, studied in Morristown/Tiferes and Hadar Hatorah in Crown Heights (Chabad BT yeshivas) in the late 90s/early 00s, did small concerts and made it onto CNN by 2003,

Released Shake off the dust, got married, and got his first late night interview in 2004 with Kimmel where he says he wouldn't play on shabbos for 1, 2, or even 4 million dollars:

Youth came out in 2006 which was the peak of his record sales and popularity, No place to be came out in 2007 and then his roots tonic band disbanded.
Late 2007 he meats his guru in Jerusalem, drifts away from Chabad and into Karlin and other sects.  Takes off the beard in 2011 but claims to still be religious, in 2012 releases Spark Seeker and appeared in public without a yarmulka for the first time since becoming religious, divorces in 2013, and released akeda and schedules his first concerts on shabbos and YT in 2014.

[Dr Moose]

Dan's PI Services LLC

[churnbabychurn]

So he says he was encouraged by chabbad rabbis to bring gdlyness into the world.
They should have told him to keep gdlyness in his life, and leave worrying about bringing gdlyness to the secular world to hashem.

[sguitarist18]

Point taken - although basketball doesn't involve that nisayon at all, regardless of whether or not someone succumbs.

I think it's a question of where and how to balance the need to use the gifts hashem gave us, without taking risks to our ruchniyus.

So he says he was encouraged by chabbad rabbis to bring gdlyness into the world.
They should have told him to keep gdlyness in his life, and leave worrying about bringing gdlyness to the secular world to hashem.

We are supposed to bring godlyness into the world - however, we do that by doing what we're supposed to, and at the end of the day, it's largely a question of - we're doing what we're supposed to do, what hashem wants us to do. So if we're NOT doing what hashem wants us to do, then we're not making the world any more godly.

His rabbis were correct, he just misinterpreted how to do it.

[Dan]

He already knew his talents. Do you really think that he would go through life and not try to explore them?
Unfortunately he took things far beyond what he should have and lost the path.

Either way as Charlie Harari said, our job is to be an Avrohom, not a Noach. To reach out and find people, not just keep within. Charlie said, "Can you imagine if there were Chabad guys during the time of Noach.  Half the world would be farbrenging and saying lchaims on that boat..."

The point of us being on earth is to bring light to it and make it a place where Gd can feel at home.  Tough job, but someone's go to try.
Or as the baal shem tov said he was told by moshiach, that he would come when his wellsprings spread forth...

[elit]

So he says he was encouraged by chabbad rabbis to bring gdlyness into the world.
They should have told him to keep gdlyness in his life, and leave worrying about bringing gdlyness to the secular world to hashem.

Just curious why you ignored my questions? (I'm not a bt, if you were afraid its personal)

[sguitarist18]

We do have to reach out, or act in a way that shines. But the more you're reaching out, the MORE careful you have to be to stay balanced. If you're not sure how good your balance is, you don't do the tightrope walk.

And as far as talents, I agree with you - everyone should explore their talents. The question is how. You have lots of people who became frum and gave up the particular avenue of their talent that wasn't kosher, and found other outlets for that same talent.

I think we're going around in circles, and not really arguing.

[Dan]

We do have to reach out, or act in a way that shines. But the more you're reaching out, the MORE careful you have to be to stay balanced. If you're not sure how good your balance is, you don't do the tightrope walk.

And as far as talents, I agree with you - everyone should explore their talents. The question is how. You have lots of people who became frum and gave up the particular avenue of their talent that wasn't kosher, and found other outlets for that same talent.

I think we're going around in circles, and not really arguing.

Hard to argue with any of that.

[churnbabychurn]

I can't see the benefit of 16 YO chabbad bochurim hanging around right off the tel aviv board walk the whole summer putting tefillin on ppl.
It's all very nice bringing gdlyness to the beach, but doesn't the individuals 613 personal commandments come first?

[dovy2]

So he says he was encouraged by chabbad rabbis to bring gdlyness into the world.
They should have told him to keep gdlyness in his life, and leave worrying about bringing gdlyness to the secular world to hashem.

So the chabad basher is at it again.  You amaze me every time. Its like you live in the gera's time...

[churnbabychurn]

So the chabad basher is at it again.  You amaze me every time. Its like you live in the gera's time...

Everyone here pretty much agrees that he should have stopped performing. Hind site is 2020, but you posted a video where he explains that he was encouraged to do it. Is it different than the bochurim on the beach?
My point is that even within the chabbad hashkafa, (which I am not discussing or bashing) there are often times where "getting out there" it is way past what the rebbeh had in mind.
Do you disagree with this general observation?

[churnbabychurn]

Just curious why you ignored my questions? (I'm not a bt, if you were afraid its personal)

I guess "facts" are in the eyes of the beholder. That's the way I see things. Feel free to disagree.

[Menachem613]

So the chabad basher is at it again.  You amaze me every time. Its like you live in the gera's time...

+1 huge chip on shoulder.

[Baruch]

And even in more kosher settings, guys like Lipa still have huge nisyonos.

Huge talent comes with that.  The trick is to pull it off while remaining humble and a yiras shamayim.

Lipa doesn't have huge talent.

The song "One Day" - now that's what I call huge talent.   

[ganizzy]

"It is very rare to find a baal teshuva who has fully accepted emuna peshuta on the same level as a frum child who was spoon fed emuna from day one. How many of them have the same appreciation for chazal as the lucky few who absorbed and lived these concepts their whole life? "


It is very rare to find FFB who have the same emuna pshuta and chayus for yiddishkeit,  feel ruchniyus,  have kabbolas ol like some BT.

[yehuda S]

When you're given an incredible talent do you have the right to waste it?
Should Tamir Goodman have given up basketball or did he try to go about it with his yarmulkah and tzitzes flying in an inspiring kiddush hashem?

For the better part of a decade Matisyahu inspired jews and non-jews alike.  Then he got himself a guru who told him he was in a cult called chabad and he changed chassidus several times before succumbing to the dark side of pop culture.

Ultimately it's a really tough nisayon for anyone to be in.

This will be frowned upon by the PC police, but becoming a G-d fearing Jew can mean having to say good-bye to your 'talents'. An artist can become a BT but if his specialty is nudes, I'm pretty sure G-d doesn't want him to go on tour with his gallery so he could use his fame to speak about Judaism. And if someone is a really talented pick up artist, should he continue doing that after becoming a Ba'al teshuva? I mean, think of how many women he can influence!!

Matisyahu may be uber talented at putting thirty thousand drug addled tweens in 'the zone' at Madison square garden, but a commitment to G-d would have meant giving all that up, not continuing it under the pretense of doing the Lord's work. I'm sure he could have refocused his talents at davening for the Amud on Rosh Hashana.