Chabad.org Halachic Times

[Dan]

So what's the basis for Chabad.org's halachic times?

Specifically for fast days, why does it end 8 minutes before tzeis?
http://www.chabad.org/calendar/zmanim_cdo/aid/143790/jewish/Halachic-Times-Zmanim.htm#locationId=44122&locationType=2

[PlatinumGuy]

So what's the basis for Chabad.org's halachic times?

Specifically for fast days, why does it end 8 minutes before tzeis?
http://www.chabad.org/calendar/zmanim_cdo/aid/143790/jewish/Halachic-Times-Zmanim.htm#locationId=44122&locationType=2

Don't think that has to do with Chabad, we are more lenient with zmanim on fasts which are not deoriasa.

ETA: Same think is on MyZmanim, which indeed says R Moshe held the earlier zman is only for someone who finds fasting difficult

[whYME]

Specifically for fast days, why does it end 8 minutes before tzeis?

iirc they go by a more lenient opinion (of tzeis?) for fasts (besides 9 av) to make it easier on people.

[Dan]

iirc they go by a more lenient opinion (of tzeis?) for fasts (besides 9 av) to make it easier on people.

Appears to be lenient on 9 Av as well.

And the times are more lenient than MyZmanim.

[itsyehuda]

Appears to be lenient on 9 Av as well.

And the times are more lenient than MyZmanim.

MyZmanim seems strict to me, based on the times I see posted or circling elsewhere.

[12HRS]

Sephardim end earlier also..

[whYME]

Appears to be lenient on 9 Av as well.

And the times are more lenient than MyZmanim.

i don't remember exactly, maybe it was except yom kippur...

[dirah]

Nothing to do specifically with Minhag Chabad.
For Mitzvos D'Oraiso, we wait for the emergence of three small stars.
For Mitzvos D'Rabonon, we are more lenient and wait for the emergence of three medium stars.
The basis for this is that there is a Machlokes Haposkim when Tzeis Hakochavim is.
With a D'Oraiso, we are Machmir.
With a D'Rabonon, we are Maykil.

[dirah]

i don't remember exactly, maybe it was except yom kippur...

Correct.

[jj1000]

Nothing to do specifically with Minhag Chabad.
For Mitzvos D'Oraiso, we wait for the emergence of three small stars.
For Mitzvos D'Rabonon, we are more lenient and wait for the emergence of three medium stars.
The basis for this is that there is a Machlokes Haposkim when Tzeis Hakochavim is.
With a D'Oraiso, we are Machmir.
With a D'Rabonon, we are Maykil.

Good to know. Thanks!

[churnbabychurn]

There is a very good english book called Dvar Yom by R dovid braunfeld that was recently published that explains in great detail this confusing topic: The shitos of R'T the Gr'a the geonim re tzeis, the various minhagim in different communities over the last few hundred years and the confusion vis-a-via how this all depend on the location and when the sun reaches X degrees etc fascinating topic...

[Galitzyaner]

Let the public beware: Chabad.org times for Shkiah and Neitz are sometimes false, they're off by 2 min e.g in some parts of NYC, Miami, and Israel.  It is obviously then therefore safe to assume that their other zmanim are 'off' as well.

Until this is fixed, I'd recommend sticking to myZamanim.

[SuperFlyer]

I've had differences up to 15-20 mins from the official local times....

I use www.myzmanim.com

[dirah]

Let the public beware: Chabad.org times for Shkiah and Neitz are sometimes false, they're off by 2 min e.g in some parts of NYC, Miami, and Israel.  It is obviously then therefore safe to assume that their other zmanim are 'off' as well.

Until this is fixed, I'd recommend sticking to myZamanim.

Not that I know one way or another, but how do you know that their times are "false"?

[Galitzyaner]

I've had differences up to 15-20 mins from the official local times....

Wow, now that's really crazy.  Terrible!

I use www.myzmanim.com

Yeah, sorry for the typo, but that's exactly what I wrote.

Not that I know one way or another, but how do you know that their times are "false"?

Um, perhaps Google (google sunset and any zip or city) and everyone else is wrong, and they are right, I don't know .

[SGF]

Um, perhaps Google (google sunset and any zip or city) and everyone else is wrong, and they are right, I don't know .

Not saying one way or the other, but Does this Rabbi Google know about the halachic zmanim and understand the different shitos?

[elikay]

Not saying one way or the other, but Does this Rabbi Google know about the halachic zmanim and understand the different shitos?

+1
I wonder if some of these differences originate in whether you calculate at sea level (mishor).

[dirah]

Wow, now that's really crazy.  Terrible!Yeah, sorry for the typo, but that's exactly what I wrote.Um, perhaps Google (google sunset and any zip or city) and everyone else is wrong, and they are right, I don't know .

Basically true.

I wonder if some of these differences originate in whether you calculate at sea level (mishor).

+1
The Shita of Alter Rebbe is visual sunrise or sunset, not actual sunrise or sunset.
Thus, in a city with a mountain on the western horizon, Shkiah will be earlier.
Similarly, a city with higher eleveation, the Shkiah will be later.
Quote from myZmanim:

Hanetz and shekia (sunrise and sunset times) are affected by elevation.
To keep things compact, MyZmanim indicates elevation profiles in an abridged format: "your elevation/horizon elevation". For example, "Elevated 800/100 meters" means the zmanim were computed for a location that is elevated 800 meters above sea level with a horizon that is elevated 100 meters above sea level. In contrast, "level region elevated 800 meters" means the zmanim are for a location that is at the same elevation as the horizon; both are elevated 800 meters above sea level.

The above is with regards to Netz and Shkiah.
With regards to hours, it is different:

Shaos zmaniyos of the Gra & Baal HaTanya are based on the level region sunrise/sunset rather than the elevated above horizon sunrise/sunset.

[Achas Veachas]

http://chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/498792/jewish/Are-your-candle-lighting-times-for-Palm-Springs-CA-correct.htm

[Dan]

I've had differences up to 15-20 mins from the official local times....

For example?
Why don't people send it into them when there's a mistake?
How else will they correct it?