Author Topic: Zionist Mindset  (Read 6277 times)

Offline avadah

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Re: Zionist Mindset
« Reply #30 on: February 26, 2014, 11:57:09 AM »
I'm not a Zionist, it's just that your views are eerily similar to what's found in jihadi media.
Could be. Except for the part where I believe EY belongs to the Jews because it says it in the Torah.

Offline Menachem613

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Re: Zionist Mindset
« Reply #31 on: February 26, 2014, 11:57:23 AM »

Offline YankyDoodle

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Re: Zionist Mindset
« Reply #32 on: February 26, 2014, 12:19:42 PM »
Can someone please explain this to me?
How can someone that's not religious lay claim to Israel because it says in the Torah it belongs to the Jews if they anyways don't keep the Torah?
Jews were given a piece of land by an occupying power, it was also voted on by a majority (2/3) of the civilized nations in the world (UN). Israel then survived multiple (mostly) uninstigated wars and in so doing managed to procure more land. Based on recent history (Holocaust, pogroms etc) it is not unreasonable to think that if Jews did not have their own land they could easily be persecuted in the harshest of manners. For all of these reasons, many logical (non-religious) people conclude that Israel has a legitimate claim to their country. 

Offline Achas Veachas

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Re: Zionist Mindset
« Reply #33 on: February 26, 2014, 12:36:33 PM »
They make the same claims referenced in Rashi. The answer obviously is in the Rashi also.
You are not really addressing the issue of secular zionism, so enjoy the rest of your day!
What was the question about secular Zionism?
Dunno. Ask a secular Zionist.
Curiosity made the cat smarter.

Offline Achas Veachas

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Re: Zionist Mindset
« Reply #34 on: February 26, 2014, 12:37:32 PM »
Jews were given a piece of land by an occupying power, it was also voted on by a majority (2/3) of the civilized nations in the world (UN). Israel then survived multiple (mostly) uninstigated wars and in so doing managed to procure more land. Based on recent history (Holocaust, pogroms etc) it is not unreasonable to think that if Jews did not have their own land they could easily be persecuted in the harshest of manners. For all of these reasons, many logical (non-religious) people conclude that Israel has a legitimate claim to their country.
All good and well but it doesn't address the Arabs' claim that they were there first...
Curiosity made the cat smarter.

Offline Menachem613

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Re: Zionist Mindset
« Reply #35 on: February 26, 2014, 12:38:35 PM »

All good and well but it doesn't address the Arabs' claim that they were there first...

What's their proof?

Offline meshugener

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Re: Zionist Mindset
« Reply #36 on: February 26, 2014, 12:40:10 PM »
^ what's your point? There are many Satmar Chasidim whose children don't celebrate Pesach.
Where does Satmar come into here?
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Offline Menachem613

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Re: Zionist Mindset
« Reply #37 on: February 26, 2014, 12:42:24 PM »

Where does Satmar come into here?

They are the flip side of Zionism.

Offline meshugener

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Re: Zionist Mindset
« Reply #38 on: February 26, 2014, 12:43:44 PM »
Jews were given a piece of land by an occupying power, it was also voted on by a majority (2/3) of the civilized nations in the world (UN). Israel then survived multiple (mostly) uninstigated wars and in so doing managed to procure more land. Based on recent history (Holocaust, pogroms etc) it is not unreasonable to think that if Jews did not have their own land they could easily be persecuted in the harshest of manners. For all of these reasons, many logical (non-religious) people conclude that Israel has a legitimate claim to their country.
That's not an answer to land they took by themselves.
They were never given Jerusalem, Golan and Juda & Samaria.
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Offline meshugener

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Re: Zionist Mindset
« Reply #39 on: February 26, 2014, 12:44:33 PM »
They are the flip side of Zionism.
Gotcha
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Offline Achas Veachas

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Re: Zionist Mindset
« Reply #40 on: February 26, 2014, 12:46:38 PM »
What's their proof?
That they were here before 1947?


What do you mean? Arabs lived in Israel for years. The reason the British were so strict with allowing Jews in was because they didn't want to aggravate the Arab population.
Curiosity made the cat smarter.

Offline Dan

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Re: Zionist Mindset
« Reply #41 on: February 26, 2014, 12:48:11 PM »
That's not an answer to land they took by themselves.
They were never given Jerusalem, Golan and Juda & Samaria.
Was America given Texas or California or are they occupied mexican territories?
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Menachem613

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Re: Zionist Mindset
« Reply #42 on: February 26, 2014, 12:48:50 PM »

That they were here before 1947?

So were Jews.

Offline meshugener

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Re: Zionist Mindset
« Reply #43 on: February 26, 2014, 12:50:39 PM »
Was America given Texas or California or are they occupied mexican territories?
No.
And your point is?
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Offline Achas Veachas

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Re: Zionist Mindset
« Reply #44 on: February 26, 2014, 12:51:33 PM »
So were Jews.
And suddenly the place has been overrun by a ton of Jewish refugees who casually declared a Jewish state and marginalized the local Arab population...
Curiosity made the cat smarter.