The Tamar Epstein Saga

[SayWhat]

Honestly- kind of upset that so many people  care more about hock than kavod for rabbis. Rabbis make mistakes. Everyone makes mistakes. You are not allowed to blast a rabbi for making a mistake. There are ways of doing things in Judaism. Just like a married women can get married without getting a get first also you can't Bakst rabbis. No matter how grave of a mistake was made. Many great people have written about the horrible sin of talking bad about rabbis (and that is a fact- since we are so into facts on this thread). In all the letters written against this "heter" no one (to the best if my knowledge) called out any rabbi by name because they understand you can call out a rabbi and say bad about him. But for some reason people here think otherwise and that they are doing G-ds work by calling rabbis out. And again I repeat this whole story is horrible. Something obviously went wrong but that doesn't change the fact that there are great big rabbis- yes rabbis- that say this is not the way to go about it by us simpletons.

This was a long term process of systematic Rabinic abuse - This wasn't a "mistake"

I would and could give you the details but I don't think you'd be able to follow

[cs50]

THey mention names for you in a very unflattery way
http://daattorah.blogspot.com/2015/11/tamar-epstein-heter-new-letter-from.html

I said to the best of my knowledge. But again we don't have permission to do it. They do. And if they do it the correct way - and lsheim shamayim. Period.

[cs50]

I would and could give you the details but I don't think you'd be able to follow

You'd be surprised

[yochiek93]

This was a long term process of systematic Rabinic abuse - This wasn't a "mistake"

I would and could give you the details but I don't think you'd be able to follow

Please do
But remember its one side there is still another side to this story

[SayWhat]

Please do
But remember its one side there is still another side to this story

Based on the comments here it doesn't seem like I'm dealing with intelligent life

[yochiek93]

Based on the comments here it doesn't seem like I'm dealing with intelligent life

To the contrary! just believing one side of a story is not to bright.

[cs50]

To the contrary! just believing one side of a story is not to bright.

But don't forget that one side IS THE correct one.

[yochiek93]

But don't forget that one side IS THE correct one.

Actually in a fight there are 3 stories each side (is 2) and the correct one (3)

[churnbabychurn]

There has not been any defense of the heter from anyone yet. Only shifting of responsibility. There are no two sides here.

[yochiek93]

There has not been any defense of the heter from anyone yet. Only shifting of responsibility. There are no two sides here.

The reason being, nobody knows details.
But to say bad about someone is very easy no need for proof

[SayWhat]

The reason being, nobody knows details.
But to say bad about someone is very easy no need for proof

Lots know the details and they have written letters - all against the Heter.
I guess your point being is that the people that support the heter don't know the details in order to write letters supporting it

[yochiek93]

Lots know the details and they have written letters - all against the Heter.
I guess your point being is that the people that support the heter don't know the details in order to write letters supporting it

I meant here
 BTW from my experience by all these rabbonim in Israel they themselves don't look into it personally they trust their חצר but nebach the gabboim are not trustworthy
As someone who was a Gabbi by רשז"א once told me alot of the gabboim are like גיחזי

[SayWhat]

I meant here
 BTW from my experience by all these rabbonim in Israel they themselves don't look into it personally they trust their חצר but nebach the gabboim are not trustworthy
As someone who was a Gabbi by רשז"א once told me alot of the gabboim are like גיחזי

Why are you calling Rabbonim in Israel names? Why are you saying bad things about people much greater than you? You will be condemned to eternal hell for that

 

[churnbabychurn]

Why are you calling Rabbonim in Israel names? Why are you saying bad things about people much greater than you? You will be condemned to eternal hell for that

Because all of a sudden criticizing rabbonim is OK.

[yochiek93]

Why are you calling Rabbonim in Israel names? Why are you saying bad things about people much greater than you? You will be condemned to eternal hell for that

How do you take out from what I said that I called rabbonim names ח"ו.
Yes the gabboim are just like you just people that want to make a seen.

[yochiek93]

Because all of a sudden criticizing rabbonim is OK.

How am I criticizing I'm stating facts which you can see and check for yourself (an example would be עץ and ג )

[Ergel]

There has not been any defense of the heter from anyone yet. Only shifting of responsibility. There are no two sides here.

+1
That doesn't mean that someone maliciously corrupted and violated halacha but it's pretty clear the gedolei haposkim have rejected any possibility of her legitimately remarrying

[yuneeq]

TL;DR
"I don't know what we're talking about but if you disagree with my quick assumption you're going to hell!!

[churnbabychurn]

I meant here
 BTW from my experience by all these rabbonim in Israel they themselves don't look into it personally they trust their חצר but nebach the gabboim are not trustworthy
As someone who was a Gabbi by רשז"א once told me alot of the gabboim are like גיחזי

FYI, this was ready to go out many weeks ago but the gaavad held it up until the facts were double triple verified.

There is no "chotzer" involved here. This thread is full of direct correspondences between the rabbonim.

[yochiek93]

There is no "chotzer" involved here. This thread is full of direct correspondences between the rabbonim.

And you are 100% sure about that? I want proof because I've seen this time and time again that a rov said.... When it was all based on what his gabboim told him