Author Topic: COVIDiots  (Read 20975 times)

Offline yitzgar

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Re: COVIDiots
« Reply #60 on: October 06, 2020, 10:09:41 AM »
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/if-you-are-sick/quarantine.html

Doesnít say that here but there was another place where they put out criteria that might say that. Can you share?
I have to find it. I definitely saw it on CDC website a few weeks ago

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Re: Changed the thread title in my post just to see if anybody notices
« Reply #61 on: October 06, 2020, 10:11:53 AM »
I have to find it. I definitely saw it on CDC website a few weeks ago
Iím fairly certain the link you are referring to said to quarantine regardless if one or both were wearing masks
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Offline Lurker

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Re: Changed the thread title in my post just to see if anybody notices
« Reply #62 on: October 06, 2020, 10:15:25 AM »
Iím fairly certain the link you are referring to said to quarantine regardless if one or both were wearing masks

 8)
Failing at maintaining Lurker status.

Offline yitzgar

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Re: COVIDiots
« Reply #63 on: October 06, 2020, 10:16:31 AM »
Iím fairly certain the link you are referring to said to quarantine regardless if one or both were wearing masks
I see now it doesn't mention masks. My memory is pretty good, and I'm pretty sure it said the 15 minutes of exposure was without a mask. Wouldn't surprise me if they changed it....
Regardless I was just thinking of a scenario where someone might think that they don't really have to quarantine and are just testing to be machmir. I'm sure you can come up with a different scenario.

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Re: Changed the thread title in my post just to see if anybody notices
« Reply #64 on: October 06, 2020, 10:16:43 AM »
8)
Are you agreeing with me, or disagreeing?
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Re: COVIDiots
« Reply #65 on: October 06, 2020, 10:17:15 AM »
I see now it doesn't mention masks. My memory is pretty good, and I'm pretty sure it said the 15 minutes of exposure was without a mask. Wouldn't surprise me if they changed it....
Regardless I was just thinking of a scenario where someone might think that they don't really have to quarantine and are just testing to be machmir. I'm sure you can come up with a different scenario.
My memory is better, though I canít say
I have a memory like an Eleffant.
;)
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Re: Changed the thread title in my post just to see if anybody notices
« Reply #66 on: October 06, 2020, 10:17:36 AM »
Are you agreeing with me, or disagreeing?

Neither. Noticing.
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Offline yitzgar

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Re: COVIDiots
« Reply #67 on: October 06, 2020, 10:17:52 AM »
My memory is better ;)
Not going to argue....

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Re: COVIDiots
« Reply #68 on: October 06, 2020, 10:37:00 AM »
care to explain this.
I didn't get details, but I assume less than 15 minutes.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Offline Yehudaa

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Re: COVIDiots
« Reply #69 on: October 06, 2020, 10:41:32 AM »
Are you agreeing with me, or disagreeing?
Noticed. One or two new members have also done so recently.

Offline yochiek93

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Re: COVIDiots
« Reply #70 on: October 06, 2020, 05:43:56 PM »
1- the CDC does *not* say its airborne
2- even if airborne, masks reduce spread
you obviously don't know how to read
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/how-covid-spreads.html
Actually 3ply masks don't protect at all for airborne that is why N95s are required learn some basics about disease transmission.
3- where does the CDC require masks in the street? They only recommend it when not possible to socially distance outdoors
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/social-distancing.html
It says socially distance and wear a mask in a public setting
You seem so convinced you know everything about covid when actually nobody knows enough I speak to doctors on a daily basis, things are changing daily
Besides you can try attacking me while I actually stated it's not an excuse I'm questioning the science they are spewing.
This goes back to the same thing when people were saying I'm defending the hospital I work for to any extent without actually listening to what I have to say or the actual facts.

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Re: COVIDiots
« Reply #71 on: October 06, 2020, 07:20:11 PM »
you obviously don't know how to read
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/how-covid-spreads.html
Actually 3ply masks don't protect at all for airborne that is why N95s are required learn some basics about disease transmission.https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/social-distancing.html
It says socially distance and wear a mask in a public setting
You seem so convinced you know everything about covid when actually nobody knows enough I speak to doctors on a daily basis, things are changing daily
Besides you can try attacking me while I actually stated it's not an excuse I'm questioning the science they are spewing.
This goes back to the same thing when people were saying I'm defending the hospital I work for to any extent without actually listening to what I have to say or the actual facts.
I didnít attack you, nor did I intend to, though the tone of your post can certainly be construed as attacking me. Itís all good, though, and I apologize if you felt that I was in any way trying to attack you. I greatly appreciate your work for the community and your contributions here!

I donít know everything about COVID nor does anybody but there is plenty that is widely known. I donít have access to secret information, everything I know is public and easily available. Of course as more data comes in more information will be known.

To your points:

1)Thanks for linking to that, I believe that information was added yesterday. With that said, the wording they use is
Quote
There is evidence that under certain conditions, people with COVID-19 seem to have infected others who were more than 6 feet away. These transmissions occurred within enclosed spaces that had inadequate ventilation. Sometimes the infected person was breathing heavily, for example while singing or exercising.
Under these circumstances, scientists believe that the amount of infectious smaller droplet and particles produced by the people with COVID-19 became concentrated enough to spread the virus to other people. The people who were infected were in the same space during the same time or shortly after the person with COVID-19 had left.
Available data indicate that it is much more common for the virus that causes COVID-19 to spread through close contact with a person who has COVID-19 than through airborne transmission

I stand (somewhat) corrected, they do currently mention airborne droplets as a possible transmission method, although they do not confirm that itís airborne. (Thatís getting very technical and just for the purpose of saving face ;) ).

Your original question was why the CDC requires face masks but not respirators. Of course full global use of respirators would be better for many reasons, but itís not practical. So face masks, which definitely help to a large degree, are instead mandated. Itís not valid to ask ďBut it can still technically get through!Ē Yes, it can, which is why we still need to be cautious, but it fulfills its purpose in *reducing spread*.

2) What is your source that only N95 masks reduce airborne spread from an infected patient? This study, among many others, shows that 3 ply masks are quite effective in reducing the amount of airborne particles released. Where there is a significant difference is in protection, not source control.

3) The link you posted says exactly what I said it does.

Where I most strongly disagree with you is the claim that the science they are using is somehow arbitrary or questionable. While many pieces of information are not confirmed they are using the available data and evidence (including many pieces of confirmed informationí to issue the best guidance they could, as they always do. In what way is this unique to this virus? There are constant breakthroughs in all areas of medicine and science, which is then incorporated into the guidance issued by the CDC and other organizations.
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Re: COVIDiots
« Reply #72 on: October 06, 2020, 09:37:34 PM »
1)Thanks for linking to that, I believe that information was added yesterday.
It was. The US CDC is a joke.
״וזה כלל גדול: שישנא אדם כל דבר שקר. וכל מה שיוסיף שנאה לדרכי השקר Ė יוסיף אהבה לתורה.״ - אורחות צדיקים

Offline yochiek93

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Re: COVIDiots
« Reply #73 on: October 06, 2020, 10:29:34 PM »
It was. The US CDC is a joke.
it's been on and off since covid started that's exactly why it's a joke
Everyday it's something else
I didnít attack you, nor did I intend to, though the tone of your post can certainly be construed as attacking me. Itís all good, though, and I apologize if you felt that I was in any way trying to attack you. I greatly appreciate your work for the community and your contributions here!

I donít know everything about COVID nor does anybody but there is plenty that is widely known. I donít have access to secret information, everything I know is public and easily available. Of course as more data comes in more information will be known.

To your points:

1)Thanks for linking to that, I believe that information was added yesterday. With that said, the wording they use is
I stand (somewhat) corrected, they do currently mention airborne droplets as a possible transmission method, although they do not confirm that itís airborne. (Thatís getting very technical and just for the purpose of saving face ;) ).

Your original question was why the CDC requires face masks but not respirators. Of course full global use of respirators would be better for many reasons, but itís not practical. So face masks, which definitely help to a large degree, are instead mandated. Itís not valid to ask ďBut it can still technically get through!Ē Yes, it can, which is why we still need to be cautious, but it fulfills its purpose in *reducing spread*.

2) What is your source that only N95 masks reduce airborne spread from an infected patient? This study, among many others, shows that 3 ply masks are quite effective in reducing the amount of airborne particles released. Where there is a significant difference is in protection, not source control.

3) The link you posted says exactly what I said it does.

Where I most strongly disagree with you is the claim that the science they are using is somehow arbitrary or questionable. While many pieces of information are not confirmed they are using the available data and evidence (including many pieces of confirmed informationí to issue the best guidance they could, as they always do. In what way is this unique to this virus? There are constant breakthroughs in all areas of medicine and science, which is then incorporated into the guidance issued by the CDC and other organizations.
as for the reasoning for home made masks they state specifically it's because there aren't enough for healthcare workers doesn't that tell you something about how brainless the system is?

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Re: COVIDiots
« Reply #74 on: October 06, 2020, 10:35:13 PM »
it's been on and off since covid started that's exactly why it's a joke
Everyday it's something else as for the reasoning for home made masks they state specifically it's because there aren't enough for healthcare workers doesn't that tell you something about how brainless the system is?
Of course itís not perfect, but the guidance is reasonable. At the moment there isnít enough capacity for everyone to wear medical masks, since healthcare workers need them more. I do think at this point they should switch guidance from cloth masks to surgical masks as there seems to be no current shortage of them.
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Offline ShimshonK

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Re: COVIDiots
« Reply #75 on: October 07, 2020, 12:32:03 AM »
Of course itís not perfect, but the guidance is reasonable. At the moment there isnít enough capacity for everyone to wear medical masks, since healthcare workers need them more. I do think at this point they should switch guidance from cloth masks to surgical masks as there seems to be no current shortage of them.

Are surgical ones generally supposed to be better than cloth ones?
I wasn't aware.

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Re: COVIDiots
« Reply #76 on: October 07, 2020, 01:14:26 AM »
Are surgical ones generally supposed to be better than cloth ones?
I wasn't aware.
Yes, they are far superior
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Offline yochiek93

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Re: COVIDiots
« Reply #77 on: October 07, 2020, 01:19:44 AM »
Yes, they are far superior
this is a quote from an article I'm reading while I didn't find the peer reviewed article yet I'll look for it. It's just interesting.
Quote
So how good is a good cloth mask? The best homemade cloth masks actually achieved better filtration (79 percent) than surgical masks (62 percent to 65 percent) in a peer-reviewed study at the Wake Forest Institute of Regenerative Medicine published in April. In the study, the best cloth masks were made of heavyweight quilterís cotton with a thread count of 180 or more. Masks with even thicker thread, tightly woven like a batik, and double-layer masks with a basic cotton outer and flannel inner also proved effective.

Offline ShimshonK

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Re: COVIDiots
« Reply #78 on: October 07, 2020, 01:42:10 AM »
Yes, they are far superior
Interesting. You're referring to all cloth masks, or just homemade ones?
For example, the black masks some people wear seem to fit tighter on the face than a surgical, so I thought that they may be a bit better.
Any sources?
(This isn't a masks thread, so I'll try not to drag this on long.)

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Re: COVIDiots
« Reply #79 on: October 07, 2020, 11:02:26 AM »
Interesting. You're referring to all cloth masks, or just homemade ones?
For example, the black masks some people wear seem to fit tighter on the face than a surgical, so I thought that they may be a bit better.
Any sources?
(This isn't a masks thread, so I'll try not to drag this on long.)
The surgical masks are 3-ply. That is very effective. You can technically get a 3 ply cloth mask but most you see around are not that.
this is a quote from an article I'm reading while I didn't find the peer reviewed article yet I'll look for it. It's just interesting.
Fascinating, there is yet work to be done. Still, Iíd guess the article is referring to protection as opposed to source control, and you have to know if ďthe best cloth masksĒ are referring to 3-ply cloth masks and not the basic ones everyone is wearing.
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