Get Refusal

[EliJelly]

Most of the reasons given for most get refusals are mostly false

[Euclid]

Why is it that the overwhelming instances (historically too) are that the husband refuses to give a get rather than the wife refusing to accept the get?

[imayid2]

If a woman consented to a halachic marriage, and all of the benefits it brings her, then she must acknowledge that the man has a right to consent to the terms of the divorce (assuming he fulfilled his marital obligations, which if not we beat him up)

Practically this isn’t true.

In the overwhelming majority of cases that a BD rules a husband is obligated to divorce, we cannot force him physically to do so.

According to ORA they only step in when a husband is refusing a get that a BD has ruled he is obligated to give.

[imayid2]

Why is it that the overwhelming instances (historically too) are that the husband refuses to give a get rather than the wife refusing to accept the get?

A woman has less leverage because the man can use a heter meah Rabanim.

[Euclid]

A woman has less leverage because the man can use a heter meah Rabanim.

But how common is/was that?

[Alexsei]

But how common is/was that?

It's not something that happens every day, it's not needed that often, but it happens, I personally know one

[Euclid]

it's not needed that often

That's my question.

[imayid2]

But how common is/was that?

Part of the reason it’s not so common is probably because she knows it’s a viable option, and will give in before it’s needed.

[Euclid]

Part of the reason it’s not so common is probably because she knows it’s a viable option, and will give in before it’s needed.

Really? Why? Let him go through the process - why give in right away? Especially in old times when getting 100 rabbonim was way more difficult

[yuneeq]

Why is it that the overwhelming instances (historically too) are that the husband refuses to give a get rather than the wife refusing to accept the get?

Where is your info from? For example in Israel, I know there were more women refusers than men, though I haven't seen data on that recently.

[imayid2]

Why is it that the overwhelming instances (historically too) are that the husband refuses to give a get rather than the wife refusing to accept the get?

Obviously there were more men traveling to America etc and disappearing on their family, because women were less likely to travel solo away from their fam, but aside from that do we know if men used the get as leverage in the settlement negotiations more than women? I wonder.

[JMHO]

Welcome to DDF! Coming in with a bang!

[avromie7]

Why is it that the overwhelming instances (historically too) are that the husband refuses to give a get rather than the wife refusing to accept the get?

People don't pay as much attention to them because in the rare case where she has no halachik claims and just does it in spite, he can get a heter meah. OTOH people lump together all men who refuse to give a get regardless of whether they have a good reason for it, or they're the rare case where he has no halachik claims and just does it in spite.

[avromie7]

According to ORA they only step in when a husband is refusing a get that a BD has ruled he is obligated to give.

You give them way too much credibility.

[Euclid]

Where is your info from? For example in Israel, I know there were more women refusers than men, though I haven't seen data on that recently.

No info. Just anecdotal. Can count on 1 hand the amount of women refusers (and heter 100) that I know about, so assumed it's not common

[EliJelly]

Why is it that the overwhelming instances (historically too) are that the husband refuses to give a get rather than the wife refusing to accept the get?

טב למיתב טן דו מלמיתב ארמלו?

[imayid2]

https://open.spotify.com/episode/1ScpIbVbc5jyojFvh0EgAa
@min 27

https://open.spotify.com/episode/0DVhf4EwIRG2F79D827g5Z
@38:22

[letsgettserious]

this is false
although there may be some marriages where that is the case
most are because the man in that situation are unfortunately unwell, looking for revenge or are trying to use as leverage to get something they want (not the kids)

It is not false. I'll simplify for it you:

ORA is the main aguna organization in North America, but they deal with cases around the world.

Currently, right now, on their website there are 19 active cases (link for today)
 
Many of these cases have been going on for years, some of them for decades!

Yet we are told there is an agunah "crisis". Do you know an aguna? Does anyone know any actual agunas?

The reason so many people are calling themselves agunas but not even ORA is willing to promote as such is because they are so obviously just women who are trying to defame the ex-husband who they are battling for custody, alimony, and child support alimony.

[imayid2]

It is not false. I'll simplify for it you:

ORA is the main aguna organization in North America, but they deal with cases around the world.

Currently, right now, on their website there are 19 active cases (link for today)
 
Many of these cases have been going on for years, some of them for decades!

Yet we are told there is an agunah "crisis". Do you know an aguna? Does anyone know any actual agunas?

The reason so many people are calling themselves agunas but not even ORA is willing to promote as such is because they are so obviously just women who are trying to defame the ex-husband who they are battling for custody, alimony, and child support alimony.

The website is apparently not updated.
According to Starr they are working on an average of 75 cases at any given time. (Not that I agree to her criteria, just if you’re quoting her numbers…)

[LNS]

It is not false. I'll simplify for it you:

ORA is the main aguna organization in North America, but they deal with cases around the world.

Currently, right now, on their website there are 19 active cases (link for today)
 
Many of these cases have been going on for years, some of them for decades!

Yet we are told there is an agunah "crisis". Do you know an aguna? Does anyone know any actual agunas?

The reason so many people are calling themselves agunas but not even ORA is willing to promote as such is because they are so obviously just women who are trying to defame the ex-husband who they are battling for custody, alimony, and child support alimony.

i know three actually and that was the basis of what i wrote
how many do you know ?