Author Topic: Manalapan Kosher Chinese Express Owner Buying Non-Kosher Chicken  (Read 114406 times)

Offline Lurker

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Re: Manalapan Kosher Chinese Express Owner Buying Non-Kosher Chicken
« Reply #300 on: September 05, 2022, 10:04:33 PM »
Keeps happening is a very harsh statement. We know of what 3 occurrences in 30 years?

Not with the OK, but I know of at least 4 places in South FL that had this issue within the last 5 years. It's not a small issue.
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Offline Moshe123

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Re: Manalapan Kosher Chinese Express Owner Buying Non-Kosher Chicken
« Reply #301 on: September 05, 2022, 10:07:01 PM »
BBQ cuts are in limited supply. I wouldn't be surprised if that's the reason not to use CHK.

Years ago, I saw boxes of meat being delivered. I remember regular chassidish shechita such as Solomon.

Offline Dan

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Re: Manalapan Kosher Chinese Express Owner Buying Non-Kosher Chicken
« Reply #302 on: September 05, 2022, 10:07:56 PM »
Years ago, I saw boxes of meat being delivered. I remember regular chassidish shechita such as Solomon.
AFAIK, CH"K only allows lubavitcher shechita.
OK allows all chassidisher shechita.
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Offline Lurker

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Re: Manalapan Kosher Chinese Express Owner Buying Non-Kosher Chicken
« Reply #303 on: September 05, 2022, 10:08:26 PM »
A part of the problem as to why this keeps happening is because of the people that kasharus agencies hire.

Mashgchim may (or may not) know the ins and outs of kasharus but we would probably be better served if they had science, accounting, or investigative backgrounds.

You don't need a background in any of those things. You just need to train the mashgichim on the specifics for what they need to look out for, and hire mashgichim who look at this job as Holy. If they treat it as seriously as one who checks safrus, it eliminates 99% of the problems. The issue is hashgachos and/or mashgichim who look at it as just a way to pay the bills.
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Offline chff

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Re: Manalapan Kosher Chinese Express Owner Buying Non-Kosher Chicken
« Reply #304 on: September 05, 2022, 10:09:56 PM »
I used to pass a deli where Alle delivered meat and it just sat outside in front on the street in the open, with no kashrus or sanitary care

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Re: Manalapan Kosher Chinese Express Owner Buying Non-Kosher Chicken
« Reply #306 on: September 05, 2022, 10:11:03 PM »
I used to pass a deli where Alle delivered meat and it just sat outside in front on the street in the open, with no kashrus or sanitary care
It wasn't sealed?

Offline jye

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Re: Manalapan Kosher Chinese Express Owner Buying Non-Kosher Chicken
« Reply #307 on: September 05, 2022, 10:11:22 PM »
6-7 months ago there was that massive chicken shortage that caused Mikes Chicken to temporarily close. Restaurants couldnít get their hands on kosher chicken for any money. If there was ever an incentive to start sourcing treif chicken from Restaurant Depot, that time frame would be itÖ.

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Re: Manalapan Kosher Chinese Express Owner Buying Non-Kosher Chicken
« Reply #308 on: September 05, 2022, 10:12:19 PM »
I used to pass a deli where Alle delivered meat and it just sat outside in front on the street in the open, with no kashrus or sanitary care

Why do you think cholov yisroel milk spoils so quickly

Offline Lurker

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Re: Manalapan Kosher Chinese Express Owner Buying Non-Kosher Chicken
« Reply #309 on: September 05, 2022, 10:12:41 PM »
In that case you can never give to a non jew

You can, but only if the meat and other sensitive items are independently locked up (lock on the fridge/freezer, or a locked cage).
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Offline Lurker

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Re: Manalapan Kosher Chinese Express Owner Buying Non-Kosher Chicken
« Reply #310 on: September 05, 2022, 10:14:19 PM »
https://forums.dansdeals.com/index.php?topic=100475.0 ;)

That crossed my mind before I posted, but the issue there was primarily a difference of opinion between sofrim, which will happen in kashrus, too. The care of the sofrim wasn't really in question.
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Offline dasmo801

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Re: Manalapan Kosher Chinese Express Owner Buying Non-Kosher Chicken
« Reply #311 on: September 05, 2022, 10:14:43 PM »
At the very least, OK owes the consumer a detailed explanation of:
1. What safeguards we're in place
2. How they broke down
3. What the fix will be going forward

Absent and until they detail these three points, I dont understand how one can rely on their hashgocha on any restaurant.

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Re: Manalapan Kosher Chinese Express Owner Buying Non-Kosher Chicken
« Reply #312 on: September 05, 2022, 10:15:08 PM »
The problem of crying wolf too often. TBH when I first saw this thread and I saw Yudel Shain's blog being quoted I just moved on.
What is he even saying here?
http://yudelstake.blogspot.com/2022/08/clevelands-kashrus-operates-right-out.html
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Re: Manalapan Kosher Chinese Express Owner Buying Non-Kosher Chicken
« Reply #313 on: September 05, 2022, 10:16:05 PM »
I used to pass a deli where Alle delivered meat and it just sat outside in front on the street in the open, with no kashrus or sanitary care

Sanitary care is a different subject. The kashrus shouldnt be in question, though, because each case of meat has 2 simonim that the mashgiach is supposed to check for before he allows it into the establishment
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Re: Manalapan Kosher Chinese Express Owner Buying Non-Kosher Chicken
« Reply #314 on: September 05, 2022, 10:16:16 PM »
At the very least, OK owes the consumer a detailed explanation of:
1. What safeguards we're in place
2. How they broke down
3. What the fix will be going forward

Absent and until they detail these three points, I dont understand how one can rely on their hashgocha on any restaurant.
I'd be shocked if this wasn't forthcoming. But these things take time and it needs to be right.
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Offline ushdadude

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Re: Manalapan Kosher Chinese Express Owner Buying Non-Kosher Chicken
« Reply #315 on: September 05, 2022, 10:17:06 PM »
based on yudel shain... say what you want about him but he's usually spot on in when it comes to research like this.... a lot of times he may come to a conclusion based off of his "evidence" which is according to his discretion, but he is very transparent on how he came to the conclusion, and you can disagree, but its very hard to disagree on his facts...


I don't know him and only found his site through here but based on some of the comments he allows on his site it should be shut down immediately. It's doing more harm than good. What's that adage about being as careful about what comes out of your mouth as what goes in?
« Last Edit: September 05, 2022, 10:30:18 PM by ushdadude »

Offline AsherO

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Re: Manalapan Kosher Chinese Express Owner Buying Non-Kosher Chicken
« Reply #316 on: September 05, 2022, 10:17:43 PM »
You don't need a background in any of those things. You just need to train the mashgichim on the specifics for what they need to look out for, and hire mashgichim who look at this job as Holy. If they treat it as seriously as one who checks safrus, it eliminates 99% of the problems. The issue is hashgachos and/or mashgichim who look at it as just a way to pay the bills.

Itís hard enough to find generally frum mashgichim in general nowadays even without these extra qualifications.
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Offline Lurker

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Re: Manalapan Kosher Chinese Express Owner Buying Non-Kosher Chicken
« Reply #317 on: September 05, 2022, 10:19:18 PM »
Itís hard enough to find generally frum mashgichim in general nowadays even without these extra qualifications.
 

Which is why some hashgachos are pushing for much higher wages for mashgichim. It's much easier to find an erliche Yid to take the job if he has a fighting chance at supporting his family on the paycheck.
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Offline joe1234

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Re: Manalapan Kosher Chinese Express Owner Buying Non-Kosher Chicken
« Reply #318 on: September 05, 2022, 10:20:37 PM »
I know him. He has his "perks". Take his opinions with a grain of salt, look into it and decide for yourself, but he doesn't make up facts.

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